Historical Accuracy of Cultural Sensitivity?

antocya

Ad Honorem
May 2012
5,755
Iraq
#31
............ has it really come to this?

People are too scared to write a fictional book for the fear of being "Roseanne Barred".

Yeah. There's a lot of sensitivity around this because so many people have bought into the cultural appropriation thing and so someone writing about people from another culture - I think this is usually limited to cultures where most of the people are not white - this is considered sort of like stealing that culture. People say, "It's not your story to be told."



I think this is usually not as much of a problem when talking about people in ancient times. I mean, it's not like they're going to complain about it.



It's a really damaging concept to art and literature, to limit people because of their culture. But that's how it is now. Even a white girl who wear a traditional Chinese dance to a school dance in America caused a lot of controversy online. Fortunately a lot of Asians spoke out in support of her but the fact it drew any controversy at all is sad.
 
Jun 2015
122
United States
#32
I literally could of told you that without even knowing the context.

Greeks originate from two main sources actually Mycenean is already well known as the original peoples but a large part of Greece was also inhabited later on by invading Dorian's.

Not sure how this is controversial?

Who was offended that Greeks weren't Arabic or African? I'm sure native Greeks weren't.
The Dorians? Can I know who they are?

Apparently, it hasn't reached the textbooks yet and people were still holding out with the other theories: but now that they have DNA evidence, it's more conclusive and not everyone was happy with it.

Based on what I've seen of it, historical revisionists. At least that's what the things I read called them. I can send you links if you want to double check the sources.
 
Jun 2015
122
United States
#33
Yeah. There's a lot of sensitivity around this because so many people have bought into the cultural appropriation thing and so someone writing about people from another culture - I think this is usually limited to cultures where most of the people are not white - this is considered sort of like stealing that culture. People say, "It's not your story to be told."



I think this is usually not as much of a problem when talking about people in ancient times. I mean, it's not like they're going to complain about it.



It's a really damaging concept to art and literature, to limit people because of their culture. But that's how it is now. Even a white girl who wear a traditional Chinese dance to a school dance in America caused a lot of controversy online. Fortunately a lot of Asians spoke out in support of her but the fact it drew any controversy at all is sad.
I suppose that is kind of my fear, yeah. I was worried about this because I've seen a lot of things hailing Severus as the first African emperor, and I had a bit of a fear of undermining that standpoint with the story.
 

antocya

Ad Honorem
May 2012
5,755
Iraq
#34
I thought the controversy was some Afrocentrists claiming the Greeks "stole" all their ideas from Egypt, not that they themselves were Egyptian. Black Athena is a relatively old book now isn't it? And it's been debunked a lot already. Maybe there are a few different theories going around on this idea.



Interestingly, according to American racial classifications on applications, etc. you're supposed to mark you're white if your ethnicity is from the Middle East or North Africa. I suppose it is a bit confusing with someone like Anwar Sadat.
 
Jun 2015
122
United States
#35
I thought the controversy was some Afrocentrists claiming the Greeks "stole" all their ideas from Egypt, not that they themselves were Egyptian. Black Athena is a relatively old book now isn't it? And it's been debunked a lot already. Maybe there are a few different theories going around on this idea.



Interestingly, according to American racial classifications on applications, etc. you're supposed to mark you're white if your ethnicity is from the Middle East or North Africa. I suppose it is a bit confusing with someone like Anwar Sadat.
I think there were a number of theories about where they came from, including some that claimed African, Arabian, and I think, if I remember correctly, Phoenician(?) descent; and yeah, I thought it had been settled, too, but it would appear that someone actually did a full-on DNA study that finally put it to rest.
That's what I gather from the articles, anyway.

Really? I never knew people had to do that. If you don't mind me asking, is it because of the relative closeness of the Middle East and Europe?
As far as North Africa, I know there is a white population there, but I was taught that Europeans migrated there at some point and that they weren't the first ones there.
(Forgive me if I've said anything wrong or offense- I mean no harm by it, I'm just trying to learn.)
 
#36
Yeah. There's a lot of sensitivity around this because so many people have bought into the cultural appropriation thing and so someone writing about people from another culture - I think this is usually limited to cultures where most of the people are not white - this is considered sort of like stealing that culture. People say, "It's not your story to be told."



I think this is usually not as much of a problem when talking about people in ancient times. I mean, it's not like they're going to complain about it.



It's a really damaging concept to art and literature, to limit people because of their culture. But that's how it is now. Even a white girl who wear a traditional Chinese dance to a school dance in America caused a lot of controversy online. Fortunately a lot of Asians spoke out in support of her but the fact it drew any controversy at all is sad.
Fortunately I don't listen to idiots.

So I think I'm ok, online outrage or sensationalism floats over my head.

I was born in the 80's then into the 90's, my generation was raised to not give a *"*$&%. :D

The Dorians? Can I know who they are?
Unless I go on a tangent, it'd be better for you to just google it.

Basically after the ancient age of Greece i.e Agamemnon and the Mycenae, when they went into decline barbarians from the north migrated and invaded south into Greece known as the Dorians and the Ionians.

They displaced the local Greeks and a lot of the classical Greek states we know are from their origin, Sparta being one of them.

There have been two Sparta's, Sparta in the time of the Mycenae and then they were replaced with Dorian's who gave us Lycurgus and the Sparta we know of today.

In fact and this is quite a twisted fate but the Helots who the Spartans kept as serfs and abused throughout their time under their authority are actually said to be the captured original inhabitants of Sparta before the Dorian's invaded, they and their offspring were born into helot status forever more.
 
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Robert165

Ad Honorem
Jan 2010
4,266
North Georgia
#39
I'll look into that. It probably wouldn't hurt to see how things are handled there. Thank you!
Most people like Lonesome Dove the best but I actually think Comanche Moon is the best book I have ever read, of any book, ever, because (and I don't know if this was intentional by the author) it simultaneously gives you the view that some traits are largely due to circumstance and some traits are common to all people at all times. The way it does this, is, as I mentioned, the story is in parallel, mainly between whites and native americans in texas in the middle 1800's. In each group you have people who are brave and honest and hardworking and in each group you have people who are lazy and dishonest and immoral. The story get's it's effect from telling both groups side by side. It really is my favorite book I've ever read.

(the other books in the series have some elements of multiple plot lines, but, not to the degree that Comanche Moon does).
 
Jun 2015
122
United States
#40
Yeah you millennial's are screwed. :lol:

To quote Dave Chappelle ...........

"I come from a dark time compared to you younger people, when I was young and the phone rang ....... we didn't know who was calling until we answered it"
Actually, I'm not sure if I'm a millennial. I was born in '01, so I think I'm GenZ...?
I often think I was born during the wrong time period anyway. There are many time periods I'd rather be :lol:
 

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