Hitler dies in late December 1941

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,197
SoCal
#1
What if Hitler would have died in late December 1941? This is after the German offensive in the Moscow area has halted, after Pearl Harbor, and after the US's entry into WWII. Assume that Hitler chokes to death on a piece of food or something. Anyway, how would the German and Allied war efforts have progressed starting from that point in time? Also, is Goering going to succeed Hitler? If so, what would Goering be like as Fuhrer? For instance, is Goering going to support implementing the Holocaust just like Hitler was? (The Wannsee Conference was less than a month away at this point in time.) How would Goering have handled the German war effort? Also, would anti-Nazis within the German military and elsewhere have eventually attempted to assassinate Goering?

Any thoughts on all of this?
 

starman

Ad Honorem
Jan 2014
4,081
Connecticut
#2
Not sure but Goering may have been more flexible than Adolf, and tried to negotiate an end to the war in Russia. And negotiate with the western allies. I don't think he had a problem with the final solution going forward.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,197
SoCal
#3
Not sure but Goering may have been more flexible than Adolf, and tried to negotiate an end to the war in Russia. And negotiate with the western allies. I don't think he had a problem with the final solution going forward.
Are Goering's peace overtures actually going to be successful with either side, though?
 

starman

Ad Honorem
Jan 2014
4,081
Connecticut
#4
I think there was a pretty good chance that Russia, after the Kharkov disaster and subsequent German advances which so worried Stalin, would've agreed to a peace on terms favorable to Germany. After Russia was out of it the Western allies might've made peace had Goering agreed to give up all or most western conquests.
 
Jan 2013
974
Toronto, Canada
#5
I think there was a pretty good chance that Russia, after the Kharkov disaster and subsequent German advances which so worried Stalin, would've agreed to a peace on terms favorable to Germany. After Russia was out of it the Western allies might've made peace had Goering agreed to give up all or most western conquests.
I disagree. At a bare minimum, Stalin had to remove German forces from Soviet territory. Anything less and he couldn't have survived in power, which means he couldn't have survived.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,197
SoCal
#6
I disagree. At a bare minimum, Stalin had to remove German forces from Soviet territory. Anything less and he couldn't have survived in power, which means he couldn't have survived.
You think that there was a realistic chance of an internal coup against Stalin had things gone extremely badly for the USSR?
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,197
SoCal
#7
I think there was a pretty good chance that Russia, after the Kharkov disaster and subsequent German advances which so worried Stalin, would've agreed to a peace on terms favorable to Germany. After Russia was out of it the Western allies might've made peace had Goering agreed to give up all or most western conquests.
And the West is just going to throw Poland and Czechia under the bus?
 
Jan 2013
974
Toronto, Canada
#8
You think that there was a realistic chance of an internal coup against Stalin had things gone extremely badly for the USSR?
Absolutely, he would have been killed in June if everyone hadn't been too busy fighting the Nazis. Very few dictators can survive military defeat and anything less than a German withdrawal is clearly a defeat.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,197
SoCal
#9
Absolutely, he would have been killed in June if everyone hadn't been too busy fighting the Nazis. Very few dictators can survive military defeat and anything less than a German withdrawal is clearly a defeat.
Saddam was able to survive a humiliating military defeat in 1991, though.
 

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