Honoring CSA Soliders

Should Confederate Soliders Be Honored?

  • Yes

    Votes: 52 59.1%
  • No

    Votes: 27 30.7%
  • Undecided

    Votes: 9 10.2%

  • Total voters
    88
Status
Closed

Code Blue

Ad Honorem
Feb 2015
3,974
Caribbean
If you want to compare the CSA and blacks to Jews and the Reich... then you are comparing the CSA to the Reich.
I don't "want" to do it, at all. It's only necessary because of your baseless opinions.

For example, slavery in the CSA is kind of a red herring. The CSA never really had its own political existence. Southern slavery is USA slavery. And when the CSA declared itself, it simply re-adopted the existing USA system in its Constitution.

And FWIW, there were more free blacks in the USA "south" than in the "north." In the Third Reich, sooner than later, there were no free Jews at all.

As to slavery,
Black slaves in the southern USA multiplied from about 800k near the end of the importation ban to more than 4 million.
Jewish slaves in the Third Reich would generally have been worked to death or killed.

You biased opinions have nothing to do with the facts.
 
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Dec 2015
3,699
USA
In the exercise of bias, it's OK to turn the reverse the historical timeline. Blacks in the CSA never heard of the Third Reich.

This is what it sounds like, if you put facts into correct chronological; order.
Blacks were legally stripped of rights in northern states, the same way Jews were later stripped of rights in Germany.
Blacks were Constitutionally banned from some northern states, the same way Jews were later banned from Germany.

In todays world, when conversations are had involving the word Confederate, it seems that often the comparisons are made to groups like the Reich and ISIL. If you look on twitter, Tv interviews, print interviews for some the CSA flag is similar to the Third Reich or ISIL flag. Especially in the USA today when we have recently seen CSA monuments taken down....many are saying why would we want the CSA monuments, after all does one glorify the Reich in Germany. Are there statues to ISIL figures in any one Muslim majority country today?

Wrt this North South context you bring up, are you talking about the USA as a whole prior to the civil war or are you talking about the Union States of the US Civil War? If you are talking about pre civil war yes I agree that pre Civil War, the USA as a whole had unequal laws for Blacks as did the early Third Reich for Jews. By the End of the Civil War though, the Union had ended slavery in the USA. So what is this stripping of rights you speak of in the Northern states?


The US Civil War saw the Union side Vs the CSA. And the Union side had abolitionist from even the south. I would also stress that I see a few similarities between the Reich, ISIL and The CSA. Im not saying these three groups are the exact same. Though I do recognize a few similarities..more so between the CSA and ISIL because both were religious and both lacked international recognition. IMO the US Civil War era saw liberals seeking to end slavery from North and South, folks such as John Brown is a famous one. Brown was from the North but worked with Southerners in opposition to slavery. Moncure Conway was a Southern Preacher that opposed slavery. What do you think about this? This is the big issue, during the US civil war black people did gain freedom when slavery was ended in 1865 in the USA. Throughout its existence, slavery existed in The Reich, The ISIL, and The CSA. Honestly thats a big thing, what do you think about that is that not enough to show that there is far less or no comparing the Union side to a group like the Reich or ISIL?
 
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Code Blue

Ad Honorem
Feb 2015
3,974
Caribbean
I don't "want" to do it, at all. It's only necessary because of your baseless opinions.

For example, slavery in the CSA is kind of a red herring. The CSA never really had its own political existence. Southern slavery is USA slavery. Even if the CSA had even one year of a stand-alone existence, there might be a basis of comparison.

And FWIW, there were more free blacks in the USA "south" than in the "north." In the Third Reich, sooner than later, there were no free Jews at all.

As to slavery,
Black slaves in the southern USA multiplied their population from about 800k near the end of the importation ban to more than 4 million.
Jewish slaves in the Third Reich would generally have been worked to death or killed. It's called the Holocaust.

You biased opinions have nothing to do with the facts.
 
May 2019
160
Salt Lake City, Utah
JakeStarkey said:
If you want to compare the CSA and blacks to Jews and the Reich... then you are comparing the CSA to the Reich.

I don't "want" to do it, at all. It's only necessary because of your baseless opinions.

For example, slavery in the CSA is kind of a red herring. The CSA never really had its own political existence. Southern slavery is USA slavery. Even if the CSA had even one year of a stand-alone existence, there might be a basis of comparison.

And FWIW, there were more free blacks in the USA "south" than in the "north." In the Third Reich, sooner than later, there were no free Jews at all.

As to slavery,
Black slaves in the southern USA multiplied from about 800k near the end of the importation ban to more than 4 million.
Jewish slaves in the Third Reich would generally have been worked to death or killed.

You biased opinions have nothing to do with the facts.
You can argue the above if you want, I don't care.

One example of your mistaken logic: black slaves were not worked to be killed in the South. That happened in the Caribbean sugar plantations, yes, but not as a deliberate process to get rid of slaves. Such is counter productive.

I have noticed that when you have trouble caring an argument that you say the other poster is "biased." :) I will step away from this now.
 

Code Blue

Ad Honorem
Feb 2015
3,974
Caribbean
the USA as a whole had unequal laws for Blacks as did the early Third Reich for Jews.
The point is not that the laws are unequal. I am not talking about degraded or second class citizenship in the north (and west). Banning black entry is denying citizenship altogether. The point is: who would have less standing to complain about how some other states treats blacks than the ones who say blacks are savages, and don't let them in at all. BTW, I first learned about this idea from my boy, Malcolm X. He did a real number on the white liberals.

Though I do recognize a few similarities..more so between the CSA and ISIL because both were religious and both lacked international recognition.
Does it take time to get international recognition? Isn't it customary for one to win the war for independence BEFORE getting recognition?

However, I am intrigued, by your view that the CSA - and let's call it the southern USA - were "religious." Tell me about that. Tell me how that relates to throwing off wicked government in 1776 and 1861, and how that relates to slavery vs the slave trade. And then tell me about that re the thread topic. The lowly soldier.

IMO the US Civil War era saw liberals seeking to end slavery from North and South, folks such as John Brown is a famous one. Brown was from the North but worked with Southerners in opposition to slavery. Moncure Conway was a Southern Preacher that opposed slavery. What do you think about this?
Let's take the easy part, first. You mentioned religion? John Brown had the look of a man possessed by demons - a man born to be hanged. He was a sociopath used by rich men for pollical purpose, and they got their martyr.

And opposed to slavery? Do you think maybe, this is not a simple binary issue? Up until this time, where in the world, had there not been slavery, and people opposed to it? It's just a whole bunch easier to state principles than to live up to them. Most Americans cannot stick to a diet plan.

The Founders were opposed to slavery. And yet, they gave it "perpetual" legal protection. This is why the US war against slavery had to be a war against the Constitution. This is why in the aftermath, they changed it. IMO, the "war" had long been against the Constitution and the slaves were pawns. Moneyed interests in the north that spend 40 years revving up printing presses and revving up anti-Southern vitriol, did not give a hoot about "the Negro" or they would have bought the slaves and given them freedom in their own northern home states.
 
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Code Blue

Ad Honorem
Feb 2015
3,974
Caribbean
That's not nearly the whole quote, is it.
No, the rest is as I said, Hitler putting for the same arguments that are put forth on this forum to claim secession is unconstitutional.

Can't you do better than imply selectivity, without evidence? If you think any of the points I made about Hitler and States' Rights (generally and US) are disproved by the rest of the text, make your case.

If your avatar is who I think it is, he did not engage in guerilla warfare, harry and run skirmish.
 
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Sep 2014
911
Texas
irony..Native American members of my family rooted for the Confederacy in old movies because to them Sherman, Sheridan and Custer were the real bad guys.
 
Likes: sparky
Status
Closed

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