How do you defend against the Mongols?

Oct 2013
12,757
Europix
The lands mentioned are mostly eastern European, not central Europe that you said. While the lands might have been controlled by central Europeab powers, the actual lands raided appear to be.eastern, not central, Europe.

If the Golden Horde came back to invade the lands near Krackow or Polish proper, please point that out.
I don't remember exactly the source (but I think I can find it, eventually), but the last steppes warriors (Tartars) raid in central Europe (northwestern Hungary/southern Poland) was in the second half of the 18th c.
 

Bart Dale

Ad Honorem
Dec 2009
6,866
Maybe I missed something in this discussion, but title of the tread is how to defend against Mongols. There is nothing about particular region or particular fraction of Mongol empire. Later attacks were not by Golden Horde, but by Crimean Khanate. Golden Horde was defeated. Last Khan of Golden Horde died in Lithuanian prison in Kaunas.
The assumption is that the Golden Horde and others had similar arms and tactics as the Mongols, being descended from them. What worked for drfending these should work against the Mongols.
 
Dec 2017
433
Australia
The lands mentioned are mostly eastern European, not central Europe that you said. While the lands might have been controlled by central Europeab powers, the actual lands raided appear to be.eastern, not central, Europe.

If the Golden Horde came back to invade the lands near Krackow or Polish proper, please point that out.
Crimean Khanate raided what is present day Ukraine mostly. As it was in the vicinity of Crimea (Crimean Khanate) and southern Russia was also raided not passing Oka river.

Belarus was not raided as it was part of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, whose grand dukes successfully fought Tatars. The terrain in southern Belarus is such that Tatar cavalry could pass in winters on frozen ground. Although, a couple of battles happened on territories of present day Belarus against Tatars.
 

Bart Dale

Ad Honorem
Dec 2009
6,866
Crimean Khanate raided what is present day Ukraine mostly. As it was in the vicinity of Crimea (Crimean Khanate) and southern Russia was also raided not passing Oka river.

Belarus was not raided as it was part of the Grand Duchy of Lithuania, whose grand dukes successfully fought Tatars. The terrain in southern Belarus is such that Tatar cavalry could pass in winters on frozen ground. Although, a couple of battles happened on territories of present day Belarus against Tatars.
Exactly my point. Ukraine is not central Europe
 
Dec 2017
433
Australia
The world book of Guinness officially recognises the centre of Europe in Lithuania, 26km north oif Vilnius

Geographical Centre of Europe

In 1989, scientists of the French National Institute of Geography declared the geographical centre of Europe to be in Lithuania, 26 kilometres north of Vilnius. The geographical centre of Europe is decorated with a composition created by the famous Lithuanian sculptor Gediminas Jokūbonis and dedicated to the accession of Lithuania to the EU. It is a white granite column decorated with a crown of stars.

Geographical Centre of Europe | Vilnius Tourist Information Centre
 

Bart Dale

Ad Honorem
Dec 2009
6,866
I don't remember exactly the source (but I think I can find it, eventually), but the last steppes warriors (Tartars) raid in central Europe (northwestern Hungary/southern Poland) was in the second half of the 18th c.

By the 18th century, the Golden Horde Han been conquered by Russia, and the Turks if the Ottoman Empire had begun it's long decline. The Turks were decisively beaten at the 2nd siege of Vienna in the 17th century.

You really need to provide a source. Th
 
Oct 2013
12,757
Europix
By the 18th century, the Golden Horde Han been conquered by Russia, and the Turks if the Ottoman Empire had begun it's long decline. The Turks were decisively beaten at the 2nd siege of Vienna in the 17th century.



You really need to provide a source. Th


In the Austro-Turkish War (1716–1718), the Crimeean and Dobrudgea tatars entered and devastated Eastern Hungary (Transilvania and Maramures)*.
I still have the impression having had red about later raids, but I have to look for sources (it predates the internet, so I have to find my notes - if I made any on this specific matter).

BTW, although You are right on the Golden Horde and OE, we shouldn't forget the Budgeak horde, or the Dobrudgea Tatars.

The Budgeak Horde raided Kishiniev (Chișinău) in 1780's, for example.
________________
* (the Hungarian page on the war is briefly mentioning it : Utolsó tatárjárás – Wikipédia).
 
Mongols' chief source of power came from grazing land for their horses. They carried little food, since they just drank horse blood and milk. So one way to stop them is to burn and salt all grazing land withing 1000 miles of your city.
 
Sep 2011
4,702
Mongols' chief source of power came from grazing land for their horses. They carried little food, since they just drank horse blood and milk. So one way to stop them is to burn and salt all grazing land withing 1000 miles of your city.
That's a fairly old observation about the situation: In most of Europe limited grazing is a built-in feature. So its questionable if it would even be necessary to burn it to make trouble for the Mongols.
 
Oct 2013
12,757
Europix
Mongols' chief source of power came from grazing land for their horses. They carried little food, since they just drank horse blood and milk. So one way to stop them is to burn and salt all grazing land withing 1000 miles of your city.
As Larrey said, grazing is "limited built-in feature". It's not for nothing that practically all steppe warriors settled in Panonian plain: altho not ideal, it's the last one more or less suited.

Scorched-land tactics, quite extensively used in Central/Eastern Europe comprised burning the straw reserves. Salting? Never!

Firstly, salt was expensive.

Secondly, You wanna be able to use that land after You've got red of the invader. After-all, You want to deny Your aggressor resources, not Yourself, and for ages.