How related were the pre-italic, celtic and illyrian tribes

Aug 2019
571
North
The pre-italics inhabited the region just north of the balkans, and maybe towards the south were illyrians dwelt. North of the pre-italic dwelt the celts. I'm interested in what relations these three ethnical groups were, before the pre-italics decided to move west and populate italy.
 
Last edited:

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
6,129
Portugal
The pre-italics inhabited the region just north of the balkans, and maybe towards the south were illyrians dwelt. North of the pre-italic dwelt the celts. I'm interested in what relations these three ethnical groups were, before the pre-italics decided to move west and populate italy.
I am not sure what you mean here by pre-Italic here.

It is an unusual terminology, especially when you say that they were north of the Balkans, between the Illyrians in the South and the Celts in the North. Seems a confusing terminology and chronology.

I always saw that terminology used for the peoples of the Italic peninsula, pre-Indo-European, before the arrival of the Indo-Europeans known as Italics.

Can you point me to some work/article/link that mentions them as you described?

Thank you.
 
Aug 2019
571
North
I am not sure what you mean here by pre-Italic here.

It is an unusual terminology, especially when you say that they were north of the Balkans, between the Illyrians in the South and the Celts in the North. Seems a confusing terminology and chronology.

I always saw that terminology used for the peoples of the Italic peninsula, pre-Indo-European, before the arrival of the Indo-Europeans known as Italics.

Can you point me to some work/article/link that mentions them as you described?

Thank you.
Read the post by the user ygor coelho:

 

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
6,129
Portugal
Read the post by the user ygor coelho:
When I requested a link it was implied that it was to a history site/article/work, not to a quora user. But maybe I should have stated it in a more clear way and not implied it.

Furthermore that quora user doesn’t even mention “pre-italics”. Not that I am disagreeing with what he says. Basically what he says can be found in works on the subject or even in generic Encyclopaedias. But again he doesn’t mention the “pre-italics”.

Let me say again this:

“I always saw that terminology used for the peoples of the Italic peninsula, pre-Indo-European, before the arrival of the Indo-Europeans known as Italics.”

What he does mention are the proto-Italics, the peoples that turned into Italics.

And someone corrects me here if I am wrong.
 
Aug 2019
571
North
When I requested a link it was implied that it was to a history site/article/work, not to a quora user. But maybe I should have stated it in a more clear way and not implied it.

Furthermore that quora user doesn’t even mention “pre-italics”. Not that I am disagreeing with what he says. Basically what he says can be found in works on the subject or even in generic Encyclopaedias. But again he doesn’t mention the “pre-italics”.

Let me say again this:

“I always saw that terminology used for the peoples of the Italic peninsula, pre-Indo-European, before the arrival of the Indo-Europeans known as Italics.”

What he does mention are the proto-Italics, the peoples that turned into Italics.

And someone corrects me here if I am wrong.
It's self-evident that I meant proto-italics and not "pre"-italics.

You don't have anything to add as to your previous post?
 

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
6,129
Portugal
It's self-evident that I meant proto-italics and not "pre"-italics.

You don't have anything to add as to your previous post?
It was not self-evident to me. I only noticed that possible error of yours when you provided the link.

And yes, I have something more to add: the proto-Italics were possibly Indo-Europeans, as the Illyrians and the Celts, while the pre-Italics were not Indo-Europeans.

So, you already have a link between proto-Italics, Illyrians and Celts. Even if I have doubts that they were all contemporary.
 
Apr 2018
314
Italy
Pre Italic: not IE people in Italy as Etruscans, Nuragic Sardinians, Reti, Camuni, Sicani, Liguri, Elymi, Enotrians

Proto Italic: IE speaker from what Latino Faliscan and Osco Umbrians languages derived.

Seems that Italic and Celtic languages share some common features, however there isn't consensus about the origin of this, if because there was a Proto Italo Celtic language from what families derived or because they were different but in close contact so they srared some features.

Illyrian was spoken in today Puglia by Messapian, Dauni and Paucetii.

Veneti are of uncertain affiliation, but rpobabily were Italic people of Latino.Faliscan group.
 

Tulius

Ad Honorem
May 2016
6,129
Portugal
Pre Italic: not IE people in Italy as Etruscans, Nuragic Sardinians, Reti, Camuni, Sicani, Liguri, Elymi, Enotrians

Proto Italic: IE speaker from what Latino Faliscan and Osco Umbrians languages derived.

Seems that Italic and Celtic languages share some common features, however there isn't consensus about the origin of this, if because there was a Proto Italo Celtic language from what families derived or because they were different but in close contact so they srared some features.

Illyrian was spoken in today Puglia by Messapian, Dauni and Paucetii.

Veneti are of uncertain affiliation, but rpobabily were Italic people of Latino.Faliscan group.
Good Summary.