If Poland keeps the Kresy, is the rest of Ukraine going to remain in Russia's orbit?

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
13,833
SoCal
#1
Here's my scenario: Britain and France confront Hitler over the Sudetenland. German Generals who are scared of a new World War quickly overthrow Hitler and the Nazis, thus preventing the outbreak of World War II. In this scenario, Poland is never attacked by Germany and thus gets to keep all of its 1937 territories (Poland never acquires Teschen in this scenario, though).

Fast-forward several decades later, and the Soviet Union still collapses either near the end of the 20th century or in the early 21st century. Now, my question is this:

Does the rest of Ukraine (as in, the parts of Ukraine that were previously under Soviet rule in this TL--which would exclude Galicia, Volhynia, northern Bukovina, Subcarpathian Ruthenia, and the Budjak) eventually fall back into Russia's orbit after the end of the Cold War in this scenario--perhaps with this process culminating in a new political union between Ukraine and Russia? Or does Ukraine still maintain its independence in this scenario and maintain a distance from Russia?

I know that Poland had a program to promote the break-up of the Soviet Union in the interwar years--a program which would have likely continued for decades in this scenario due to the lack of World War II:

Prometheism - Wikipedia

However, with Ukraine's most anti-Russian parts remaining under Polish rule, would there have been enough support in Ukraine for Ukraine to still pursue a pro-Western course in this scenario?

Any thoughts on this?
 
Jun 2016
1,758
Russia
#2
However, with Ukraine's most anti-Russian parts remaining under Polish rule, would there have been enough support in Ukraine for Ukraine to still pursue a pro-Western course in this scenario?

Any thoughts on this?
As anti-Russian you may call Ukrainians much more they were anti-Polish. Just to remind that idol of today's Ukrainian Nazi Bandera before killing Russians and Jews started to kill Poles. That had historical reasons: Poles were lords (no matter whom they were before they were polonized), Ukrainians were servants - and all that lasted until 1917. Remember, how you love your boss and imagine how huge was hatred of Ukrainians toward Poles.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
13,833
SoCal
#3
As anti-Russian you may call Ukrainians much more they were anti-Polish. Just to remind that idol of today's Ukrainian Nazi Bandera before killing Russians and Jews started to kill Poles. That had historical reasons: Poles were lords (no matter whom they were before they were polonized), Ukrainians were servants - and all that lasted until 1917. Remember, how you love your boss and imagine how huge was hatred of Ukrainians toward Poles.
Semyon Petlura allied with the Poles against the Soviets, though.
 
Nov 2015
1,538
Kyiv
#6
As anti-Russian you may call Ukrainians much more they were anti-Polish. Just to remind that idol of today's Ukrainian Nazi Bandera before killing Russians and Jews started to kill Poles. That had historical reasons: Poles were lords (no matter whom they were before they were polonized), Ukrainians were servants - and all that lasted until 1917. Remember, how you love your boss and imagine how huge was hatred of Ukrainians toward Poles.
 
Nov 2015
1,538
Kyiv
#7
A That had historical reasons: Poles were lords (no matter whom they were before they were polonized), Ukrainians were servants - and all that lasted until 1917. Remember, how you love your boss and imagine how huge was hatred of Ukrainians toward Poles.
- for you, probably, will be great news that the largest Polish tycoons Vishnevetsky were Ukrainian gentry? And a number of historians considere their Dmitro "Baida" Vishnevetsky the founder of the Zaporozhye Sich. It would be useful for you to read something of the issue and after that make very noisy statements.

You can start from that study about the Ukrainian gentry of the 14th-17th century

 
Jun 2016
1,758
Russia
#8
- for you, probably, will be great news that the largest Polish tycoons Vishnevetsky were Ukrainian gentry? And a number of historians considere their Dmitro "Baida" Vishnevetsky the founder of the Zaporozhye Sich. It would be useful for you to read something of the issue and after that make very noisy statements.
I don't argue with you who was Wisniewecki or Radziwill. I wrote what the people whom we now call "Ukrainians" thought about Wisniewecki and other POLISH pans. All Ukrainians, including your Nazi idol Bandera. Btw, Wisniowecki himself thought about himself as a Pole, not a smallest doubt.
 
Jun 2016
1,758
Russia
#9
Semyon Petlura allied with the Poles against the Soviets, though.
Would you please ask some Poles, what they think about this ally. There was only smallest minority of Ukrainians who joined the bands of this anti-Semithe murder, which could compete with "final solution of Jewish question" 2 decades later.
 
Jun 2016
1,758
Russia
#10
There is now a tendence in Belarus and in Ukraine to call their Polish rulers Belarussians and correspondently Ukrainians, as if it can add something to the glory of Belarussians and Ukrainians. As if the fact that there nations upheld their language, their faith, their culture in centuries, in spite of Polish pressure. Their nobles betrayed their people, changed language, religion and culture and became Poles. They wanted the people to join them, they could insist very much, but in vain.
 

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