If you were in charge of Russia and wanted to expand into Ukraine, how much Ukrainian territory would you take?

[lexell]

Russia already spent a lot of money on Crimea barely coping. Russians say when they came to Crimea things didn't not change in hospitals since early 80s. Sanitary in schools and kindergardens were below standard. Infrastructure in terrible conditions.

 

[betgo]

All of it. I would want borders similar to the post-war Soviet Union or Russian Empire in 1900.

 

[Vaderfan]

All of it. I would want borders similar to the post-war Soviet Union or Russian Empire in 1900.

That would start a war with NATO though.

 

[sparky]

No , Nato would screech but do very little , Ukraine like Georgia has only value for agravation ,
not starting unlimited warfare ,
Europe has little taste for being the nuclear battleground of some geopolitical "mine is bigger than yours "
it always was an US policy to poke the bear
if you think otherwise , you are buying into the Nato delusion
it's only a shopfront for the US armament industry

 

[Vaderfan]

No , Nato would screech but do very little , Ukraine like Georgia has only value for agravation ,
not starting unlimited warfare ,
Europe has little taste for being the nuclear battleground of some geopolitical "mine is bigger than yours "
it always was an US policy to poke the bear
if you think otherwise , you are buying into the Nato delusion
it's only a shopfront for the US armament industry

To achieve the post-war Soviet Union borders would entail not only an annexation of Ukraine, but also Baltic states, who are not only a part of NATO, but also EU. Leaving them to be swallowed by the bear, would certainly lead to the end of both NATO and EU, and especially later I want to believe European elites won't allow.

 

[AlpinLuke]

Wait ...

it depends on how ...

On a different forum I discussed the eventuality of an open conflict between Ukraine and Russia. In that case Ukraine would have only an opportunity: to concentrate the forces around Kiev to gain defensive depth for a desperate last defense of the capital.

A hopeless defense.

Anyway ...

If Putin wants to be politically correct and make his "friend" happy [Lady Polonskaya], Russia can stop after annexing Crimea.

If Vladimir wants to impose the power of Russia, Dombass is a possibility. But that's it. End of history.

Pragmatically I don't think that Moscow could be interested in conquering other Ukraine lands: Crimea and Dombass will be Russian, this is my prediction.

 

[Futurist]

From whom?

From the Ukrainians, of course.

All of it , of course

Even ultra-nationalistic Galicia and Volhynia?

None! It will be a burden. Ukraine is a shadow of it was during soviet era in terms of industrial, research and military potential. Entire country made a contribution in the development of Ukrainian SSR. Russia should not take any. Russia has many problems of its own.

So, even taking Crimea was a mistake?

 

[Futurist]

Wait ...

it depends on how ...

On a different forum I discussed the eventuality of an open conflict between Ukraine and Russia. In that case Ukraine would have only an opportunity: to concentrate the forces around Kiev to gain defensive depth for a desperate last defense of the capital.

A hopeless defense.

Anyway ...

If Putin wants to be politically correct and make his "friend" happy [Lady Polonskaya], Russia can stop after annexing Crimea.

If Vladimir wants to impose the power of Russia, Dombass is a possibility. But that's it. End of history.

Pragmatically I don't think that Moscow could be interested in conquering other Ukraine lands: Crimea and Dombass will be Russian, this is my prediction.

It's Poklonskaya, not Polonskaya:

Natalia Poklonskaya - Wikipedia

Also, what about Kharkiv, Zaporizhia, and Odessa? All of these regions are almost half Russophone.

 

[lexell]

From the Ukrainians, of course.


Even ultra-nationalistic Galicia and Volhynia?


So, even taking Crimea was a mistake?

From the Russian point of view it wasn't due to its strategic location on the Black Sea. Particular the location of Sevestopol.

 

[sparky]

Even ultra-nationalistic Galicia and Volhynia?
yes ,
Ukraine loose the East and South which is reunited to Russia ,
the rest keep its status as a federal country but is broken up into financially and administratively autonomous provinces
this would make its governance a mess keeping them into a state of constant disunity

the wealth is in the East and in the central farming zone , Galicia is poor ,
their main source of income was always to sponge off the East
that was one of the big motive for the Easterners feeling disgruntled with Kiev