Judaism AMA

AlpinLuke

Ad Honoris
Oct 2011
26,232
Italy, Lago Maggiore
#71
Early Israel was substantially a Socialist country. Imagine that when US imposed an embargo about selling weapons to Middle East, Israel obtained weapons from USSR through Czechoslovakia. At the end, you know, Marx was a Jew ... even if not an Orthodox Jew [this is evident!].

About this, I can talk about the Italian Jewish community: it's overall Socialist. Italian Jews tend to vote Democrat and to be critical with Israeli right.

But the real comment about this is ... so what? Israel is a democracy [the only real democracy in Middle East, by the way ...].
 

Maki

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
2,868
Republika Srpska
#72
A bit of a controversial question:

how is the Bible interpreted? I mean, do Judaism holds that events in the Bible really happened as described in the Bible? Or do they interpret it metaphorically?
 
Dec 2015
3,610
USA
#73
Abraham also know I respect you, Im not challenging you on Judaism clearly you know of the Jewish religion more so then myself.

A few more questions I have,

Would a proper Jewish state have national healthcare, in other words free healthcare for all?

Would a proper Jewish state allow alcohol to be served in restaurants and for that matter bars and nightclubs to be open?
 
Jul 2019
107
New Jersey
#74
I think I'm going to leave off of this debate on whether or not a Jewish State can recognize homosexual marriages. If the discussion concerned actual scholarship or historical discussion I would be fine with continuing it, but at the current rate we aren't getting anywhere. I say every Jewish thinker has been unambiguously opposed to homosexual behavior for the past three millennia; you point to the opinion of contemporary Jews (the vast majority of whom aren't religious) who support such legislation. I don't think this conversation has the potential to go much beyond that.

You know alot about Judaism it seems, do you speak fluent Hebrew if I may ask? Would you say in Judaism its a requirement to speak or learn Hebrew. Is Hebrew the language of the earliest Jews or was it a different language?
I would divide Hebrew into two general categories: old Hebrew and modern Hebrew (a linguist can tell you that "old Hebrew" itself has changed many times over the millennia, but that's not my point).

Old Hebrew is the language of the Bible and the prayers. While there is no absolute religious commandment to understand Hebrew (as indeed, many religious Jews don't), I would still say that it's pretty important that one learn it if he can, in order to better understand the Bible and prayers.

Modern Hebrew (the Hebrew you hear spoken on the streets of Israel) is different. It is essentially a modern version of Hebrew, designed to be a colloquial language in the modern world. Although it is clearly a version of Hebrew, it differs dramatically from old Hebrew in its grammar and pronunciation. As far as I'm concerned there's no religious value in knowing modern Hebrew. I, personally, am fluent in both Biblical and modern Hebrew.

Would a proper Jewish state have national healthcare, in other words free healthcare for all?
Not everything is purely about religion. Judaism is not a political manifesto. The pros and cons of any secular policy ought to be debated and legislated through the normal legislative channels. A Jewish state is definitely called upon to more caring than, say, Ayn Rand, but the particulars of what makes good policy ought to be up to the legislature.

Would a proper Jewish state allow alcohol to be served in restaurants and for that matter bars and nightclubs to be open?
The Jewish religion has no problem with alcohol in moderation. As far as nightclubs and pubs are concerned, I honestly don't know what goes on in them. Personally, I've never entered either kind of establishment. It goes against my personal sense of religious propriety, but it's highly unlikely to be so corrosive as to necessitate their legal closure. If there are highly sexualized shows or kids in drag then yeah, I'd say shut them down. Otherwise, what do I know? Different people do different things.
 
Likes: benzev
Aug 2016
977
US&A
#75
It seems like @JoanOfArc007 is trying to argue for a concept of Judaism that doesnt see homoxuality as a sin. I am not interested in arguing, but the this led me to think of another question.

I have seen other atheists like myself claiming there is little evidence in the bible to support the idea of homosexuality being sinful, and that there are many passages that seem to contradict each other.

You have said there are multiple passages in the Torah (and the other books?) condemning homosexuality. Would you name some of the ones that demonstrate this most obviously?
 
Jul 2019
107
New Jersey
#76
I have seen other atheists like myself claiming there is little evidence in the bible to support the idea of homosexuality being sinful, and that there are many passages that seem to contradict each other.

You have said there are multiple passages in the Torah (and the other books?) condemning homosexuality. Would you name some of the ones that demonstrate this most obviously?
That seems to me to be a rather astonishing claim, considering as there are two verses in the Book of Leviticus that explicitly and quite harshly condemn homosexual activity between males. Leviticus 18:22 states "You shall not lie with a male as with a woman; it is an abomination. " Later on in the same book (20:13), the Bible lays out the penalty for homosexual activity: "If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them."

(I should add that the Oral Torah limits the possibilities under which the death penalty may be administered for any crime, to the extent that a court which killed even once in 70 years was known as a "bloodthirsty court", so in this instance the penalty is more symbolic than actual).

In any event, that's prettty explicit. To the best of my knowledge there is no contradiction to this. The Mishna and Talmud reference the prohibition against homosexual activity dozens, if not hundreds, of times throughout those works. Maimonides included in his Mishneh Torah both the prohibition against both homosexual and lesbian relations. Here's his text about male homosexual activity (Laws of Forbidden Relations 1:14) and lesbian activity (ibid 21:8). Like I've said, if we go through the entire corpus of Jewish law I can find you thousands of references of this nature.

"When a man enters into relations with a male or has a male enter into relations with him, once the corona is inserted [into the anus] they should both be stoned if they are both adults. As [Leviticus 18:22] states: "Do not lie with a man," [holding one liable for the act, whether] he is the active or passive partner."

"Lesbian relations are forbidden. This is "the conduct of Egypt" which we were warned against, as [Leviticus 18:3] states: "Do not follow the conduct of Egypt." Our Sages said: What would they do? A man would marry a man, a woman would marry a woman, and a woman would marry two men.

Although this conduct is forbidden, lashes are not given for it, for it is not a specific prohibition and there is no intercourse at all. Therefore such women are not forbidden to marry into the priesthood as harlots, nor does a woman become prohibited to her husband because of this, for this is not considered harlotry. It is, however, appropriate to give them stripes for rebellious conduct because they performed a transgression. A man should take precautions with his wife with regard to this matter and should prevent women who are known to engage in such practices from visiting her and her from visiting them."



All this having been said, I would be greatly interested in hearing where this prohibition is contradicted. I would also add that the "contradictions" many people see in the Bible is due to their ignorance of the Oral Torah, which generally resolves these sorts of questions.
 
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