justice exists

Rodger

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
6,113
US
#71
Do you think that the poor and the weak would be better off with no laws and justice at all?
Are laws and justice mutually compatible and correlated? The former is the "rules" and the latter is how they are applied. Not always the same.
 
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Rodger

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
6,113
US
#72
So because without wealth cannot transfer it to others to defend them, justice doesn't exist.

I guess because poor cannot afford absolute best doctors, then medicine doesn't exist.
The poor cannot hire the best teachers, instructors, professors, so education is not real.
Because poor cannot eat the greatest cooked foods, nutrition is a tool of the wealthy.

ROFL, this train of thought is delightfully entertaining.
There is a significant difference between having the best teacher, or even doctor, and the best attorney. Anybody who has ever had themselves or someone they love in the justice system realize how quickly two people with very similar charges can get two quite different outcomes in the justice system. Incarceration, i.e., taking away one's freedom is about the most serious impediment, short of death. Most courtrooms are public. Take a trip to the county courthouse for several days and sit in the galley. Watch how a good attorney gets a much better resolution almost every time. Anyone who would take a public Defender by choice is quite foolish.
 
Jul 2016
9,562
USA
#74
There is a significant difference between having the best teacher, or even doctor, and the best attorney. Anybody who has ever had themselves or someone they love in the justice system realize how quickly two people with very similar charges can get two quite different outcomes in the justice system. Incarceration, i.e., taking away one's freedom is about the most serious impediment, short of death. Most courtrooms are public. Take a trip to the county courthouse for several days and sit in the galley. Watch how a good attorney gets a much better resolution almost every time. Anyone who would take a public Defender by choice is quite foolish.
LOL

A crappy teacher (or series of them) creates a kid who has little access to a better future. They create an ignorant adult.

The difference between a good and bad doctor isn't freedom, its life and death. Literally. The outcome isn't getting fined, or maybe a plea bargain instead of getting charges reduced significantly or dropped, but it literally means someone ends up in a grave instead of enjoying a happy life.

The whole point of a public defender is for those who can't afford their own. Its free. You get what you pay for. Don't like it? Don't be poor. And if you're going to say that's not fair, then tell me what an individual truly denied prosperity legitimately did in their life to turn themselves around and how they were denied. You can't, not in my country, because anyone can rise to anything, and that has been proven endlessly at this point.
 

Rodger

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
6,113
US
#75
Obrigado amigo - Thank you friend

Okay, I'll give my opinion, I believe in money more than in the justice that exists in this world. For those who are against my opinion, respect it please, I also know respect your opinions.


amigo Rodger hug
You know the old saying, "money talks and something unmentionable here walks."
 

Rodger

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
6,113
US
#76
LOL. A crappy teacher (or series of them) creates a kid who has little access to a better future. The difference between a good and bad doctor isn't freedom, its life and death. Literally. The outcome isn't getting fined, or maybe a plea bargain instead of getting charges reduced significantly or dropped, but it literally means someone ends up in a grave instead of enjoying a happy life.

The whole point of a public defender is for those who can't afford their own. Its free. You get what you pay for. Don't like it? Don't be poor.
Again. Lost opportunity versus lost freedom doesn't compare. Guess what. Even a crappy attorney could get you time in jail. Try about $10 grand for a good one. Is that a "poor person" who can't afford $10 grand on a short notice? Not every innocent person is found not guilty. And not every guilty person is found so. If you think so, you have more faith in judges than I do. Speaking of judges, let one of their children get in trouble and see how they are treated. I worked over 25 years in the system and I have seen "justice" at work.
 
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Oct 2015
5,222
Matosinhos Portugal
#77
If you believe in justice I respect you.
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I say justice was fairer if it were not bought for money.
I mean money buys all the justice.

Or do you believe in Santa?
 
Jul 2016
9,562
USA
#78
Again. Lost opportunity versus os freedom doesn't compare. Guess what. Even a crappy attorney could get you time in jail. Try about $10 grand for a good one. Is that a "poor person" who can't afford $10 grand on a short notice? Not every innocent person is found not guilty. And not every guilty person is found so. If you think so, you have more faith in judges than I do. Speaking of judges, let one of their children get in trouble and see how they are treated. I worked over 25 years in the system and I have seen "justice" at work.
Again, a bad lawyer is still a lawyer. Someone may get off, they may plea bargain (the usual route for public defenders) or they fight it and lose. And then what? Do they die? Almost never, as any capital trial almost always has top tier lawyers fighting one another, pro bono, because they're against the death penalty, regardless of the case and evidence and guilt. So worse thing is someone gets life. And yet still alive, still able to appeal, still capable of later being free and even suing the same system that incarcerated them.

Now tell me what happens when you have a tumor growing in your body, and symptoms of cancer, and you go to a doctor and they don't order tests and ignore the symptoms and tell you that you have heartburn or migraines, so by the time you find out its cancer, its stage 4. What happens then? Where is that person's freedom? What about the doctor that screws up the surgery and kills you on the table, because they messed up, like they had dozens of times before, because many doctors have a double digit body count under their belt when it comes to accidentally killing their patients because of malpractice. Where is the freedom then? Where is the freedom for the goddamn idiots who shoved a feeding tube into my mother's lung and temporarily killed her, then tried to lie about and hide it, with it all resulting in her having brain damage? Where was her freedom?

FYI, I've dealt with the legal system before too, on both sides of it (not me personally, I'm conviction free, but a few relatives and close friends have done hard time). Your 10k number for getting off scott free is entirely dependent on crime, location, circumstances, evidence, etc. My uncle blew through a couple hundred grand on a defense, which should have been a slam dunk Not Guilty, and instead did eight years in a max sec state pen.

In life, you get what you pay for. Sometimes. But if you don't like what you get, do something to get more. That's what most people's parents, grandparents, and great grandparents did. They worked their butts off, despite the odds, to get a better life for themselves, or if they couldn't, then they sacrificed for the sake of their kids. They didn't bitch and moan about the unfair system of a country where the poorest people still have it better than like 75% of the world, where the pets have better access to healthcare than like 75% of the world.
 
Jul 2016
9,562
USA
#79
Or do you believe in Santa?
Justice: the maintenance or administration of what is just especially by the impartial adjustment of conflicting claims or the assignment of merited rewards or punishments

Are you saying Portugal doesn't have an impartial system? That your rights aren't protected? Or are you simply complaining because you don't have the money to pay for the very best in services from someone else?

At what point did someone else providing you a service or product have to be free or equal in order for you not to be jealous?
 
Oct 2015
5,222
Matosinhos Portugal
#80
Justice: the maintenance or administration of what is just especially by the impartial adjustment of conflicting claims or the assignment of merited rewards or punishments

Are you saying Portugal doesn't have an impartial system? That your rights aren't protected? Or are you simply complaining because you don't have the money to pay for the very best in services from someone else?

At what point did someone else providing you a service or product have to be free or equal in order for you not to be jealous?
..................................


Are you saying Portugal doesn't have an impartial system?


First I did not mention the justice of my country.
primeiro não falei da justiça do meu país.

Second, I'm not a jealous man, I'm a Latin male and I'm not jealous.
Segundo não sou ciumento,sou um macho latino e não tenho ciúmes.


Third I can not make comparisons, with American and Portuguese justice, both countries have different justice is normal.
Terçeiro eu não posso fazer comparações,com a justiça Americana e Portuguêsa,ambos os paíse tem a justiça diferentes é normal.
 

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