Karl Marx's contribution to the modern anti-semitism (and racism)

Nov 2017
866
Győr
#11
As people have suggested, it’s unlikely Marx contributed much to anything at all with antisemitism given his strong Jewish following in the near future. Also, the chief forces of antisemitism in Europe associated Marxian theory with Judaism.

The primary influencers of antisemitism were the fascists. If we want to get into which philosopher contributed the most: Friedrich Nietzsche during the time when he was still in awe by Richard Wagner and was into dramatic nationalistic and anti-Jewish overstatements; and a strong influencer of nationalism and fascism.

That said, I doubt either Wagner or Nietche would have supported the extremism of the 1930s and 40s.
It seems you did not even read the Marx quotes in the text.
Wagner was a Jew in denial. A self-hating Jew. In the rerality he had Jewish origin parents, and he tried to deny it at any price. He had not only ethnic Jewish origin, but a very typical Jewish look. It is funny and sad (tragicomic) that the virulent antisemite was himself a Jew too. Read: Was Wagner Jewish? - Limelight
 
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Nov 2017
866
Győr
#12
A part that Marx was descendant of Jews, so he was a Jew ... and a part that early Israel was a Socialist country influenced by Marx [think to the "Kibbuz" to have an idea] ...

I would say that Luther [the Reformer] gave a well bigger contribution to the justification of Anti-Semitism in Germany. He literally didn't stand Jews, not on an ethnic base, but on a religious base: they had to convert! The alternative is easy to be guessed.

So, no, I don't think we can connect Marx with the origins of Anti-Semitism.
So Jews can't be anti-semite and can't have anti-jewish sentiment? Yes, they can be both theoretically and practically. Read and learn: Self-hating Jew - Wikipedia
 

Tulun

Ad Honorem
Nov 2010
3,615
Western Eurasia
#13
A part that Marx was descendant of Jews, so he was a Jew ... and a part that early Israel was a Socialist country influenced by Marx [think to the "Kibbuz" to have an idea] ...

I would say that Luther [the Reformer] gave a well bigger contribution to the justification of Anti-Semitism in Germany. He literally didn't stand Jews, not on an ethnic base, but on a religious base: they had to convert! The alternative is easy to be guessed.

So, no, I don't think we can connect Marx with the origins of Anti-Semitism.
but don't forget, Marx was also a baptized Lutheran Christian, now all dots are connected :D
 
Oct 2013
12,766
Europix
#14
It seems you did not even read the Marx quotes in the text.
Wagner was a Jew in denial. A self-hating Jew. In the rerality he had Jewish origin parents, and he tried to deny it at any price. He had not only ethnic Jewish origin, but a very typical Jewish look. It is funny and sad (tragicomic) that the virulent antisemite was himself a Jew too. Read: Was Wagner Jewish? - Limelight
and "It seems You did not even read what Theodoric said in the post" :)

What Wagner was, how it looked like it's totally irrelevant to what Theodoric was talking about: influences/contributions to anti-Semitism.
 
Nov 2017
866
Győr
#15
and "It seems You did not even read what Theodoric said in the post" :)
Your problem is usually the text interpretation.

What Wagner was, how it looked like it's totally irrelevant to what Theodoric was talking about: influences/contributions to anti-Semitism.
Yes it is relevant. Theodoric even confused/blended the fascism and national socialist nazi ideas.
 

AlpinLuke

Ad Honoris
Oct 2011
24,531
Lago Maggiore, Italy
#16
but don't forget, Marx was also a baptized Lutheran Christian, now all dots are connected :D
Eh well ...
So Jews can't be anti-semite and can't have anti-jewish sentiment? Yes, they can be both theoretically and practically. Read and learn: Self-hating Jew - Wikipedia
Americans who hate America exist ... so I'm sure there are Jews who hate to be Jews ...

But we are discussing about an individual, so that statistics should be applied excluding exceptions. Statistically we can say that Jews are quite "nationalist" and they feel a real membership, they feel to be part of a "chosen people" in some way. So, without clues to put Marx among the exceptions, I tend to see him in the common "Jewish mass" where Anti-Semitism is absolutely absent.
 

AlpinLuke

Ad Honoris
Oct 2011
24,531
Lago Maggiore, Italy
#18
So if a Jewish person change religion, than he will lost his ethnicity? Historically strange idea. Read about Contemporary movements. Jewish Christian - Wikipedia
Historically to sustain that a Jewish ethnicity exists for real ... well, that's not that correct. The Jewish People is a kind of mix built on a filtered selection. If you visit Israel, meeting Jews from Russia, Europe, America, Africa ... you will realize that a Jewish ethnicity isn't.
 
Nov 2017
866
Győr
#19
Eh well ...


Americans who hate America exist ... so I'm sure there are Jews who hate to be Jews ...

But we are discussing about an individual, so that statistics should be applied excluding exceptions.
Logic error.

Statistically we can say that Jews are quite "nationalist" and they feel a real membership, they feel to be part of a "chosen people" in some way. So, without clues to put Marx among the exceptions, I tend to see him in the common "Jewish mass" where Anti-Semitism is absolutely absent.
It is simple and weak attempt to white-washing a racist (black heater) and anti-semite person.
 
Dec 2011
1,274
#20
Eh well ...


Americans who hate America exist ... so I'm sure there are Jews who hate to be Jews ...

But we are discussing about an individual, so that statistics should be applied excluding exceptions. Statistically we can say that Jews are quite "nationalist" and they feel a real membership, they feel to be part of a "chosen people" in some way. So, without clues to put Marx among the exceptions, I tend to see him in the common "Jewish mass" where Anti-Semitism is absolutely absent.
Without clues? The guy wrote an entire text disparaging Jews. Some scholars have interpreted this as mere hyperbole, but he does indeed not only make antisemitic statements in his letters, as the link in the OP shows, he also rejected his own "Jewishness". The latter, of course, is not evidence of him being antisemitic in itself, but Marx' self-perception does hint that your argument on the statistics is problematic.
 
Likes: janossyjanos

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