LGBT lessons in schools

Jun 2016
1,863
England, 200 yards from Wales
Yes, I mentioned it after all.

I have a different approach, I think race is something that is brought into the equation by adults while kids mostly are fine with each other.
I agree, they mostly are. But if one knows that some are taught otherwise by racist parents, is it so bad to reinforce that natural tendency to be fine with each other?


I have recently read in one of our local primary schools about "dark skinned" kids being targeted and bullied by other "dark skinned" kids for not racially identfying themselves like the other ones, I used "" because that was how it was phrased.
I wonder how that would be taught in a lesson about equality ?
I wonder too. I suspect the concern for (colour-blind) equality has become mixed up, for some people, with ideas of identity.
I like your phrase "treat each individual with respect and deal with merit and character."

If by 'loaded statement' you meant the 'Good for you', I agree that can be meant sarcastically, but I really meant good - the teaching that we care all people.
 

Naomasa298

Forum Staff
Apr 2010
35,257
T'Republic of Yorkshire
I think the confusion teens have is primarily due to being introduced to these topics on an academic level far too late. Infantalizing children and “protecting” them from knowledge does more damage than help. This sort of helicopter patenting and childish nonsense is the sort of thing current parents are attempting to get away from.

It’s a fact, teens become sexually active about 12-14 years old. No matter how much you want your 13 year old to act like a 6 year old, and your 8 year old to be more like a 3 year old, it’s not going to happen. Keeping kids ignorant hasn’t had good results - and we have the example of millennial age adults nearing 30, living with their parents, fat, afraid of the world, the maturity of 15 year olds to see that keeping kids sheltered is clearly bad parenting.

My kids play hockey in the streets with their friends just like we did about 30 years ago, but looking at 10-20 years ago, you never saw this.

Anyway, I am in favour of arming children with knowledge about the world. These backward traditionalists can whine all they want, but let the actual adults make the decisions.
I disagree. This is about being age appropriate. I wouldn't teach a five year old about quantum physics or politics or religion. They wouldn't understand it, and I certainly think it's wrong for adults to build preconceptions into their minds about subjects such as religion or politics. Now, as far as LGBT issues are concerned, I would be very happy for them to learn about it at an appropriate age. Possibly between 8-10.
 
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AlpinLuke

Forum Staff
Oct 2011
27,062
Italy, Lago Maggiore
I add a technical comment: I remember the analyst who followed me in therapy years ago. She explained to me that under 8 a child is not suitable for deep therapy since his mind is still too "fluid".

That is to say the therapist risks to dominate the mind of the child, orientating it.

Now, it was the opinion of a professional [1 professional], but curiously enough it was in agreement with what they told me in Scientology: don't use our techs on children under 8 ... they would not work.

This is why I would like to know what they teach in LGBT lessons in primary schools. If there are sensitive contents they are dangerous for children under 9 [the teacher will influence the children: at the end this is why, without scientific base, historically Catholic Church has been wanting very little children to begin their seminary].
 

AlpinLuke

Forum Staff
Oct 2011
27,062
Italy, Lago Maggiore
This was to say that probably we should need professional psychologists who work with children to make this discussion more valuable.

Anyway, I'm still waiting to read a clear example of an LGBT lesson in a classroom of a primary school: what is the teacher going to say to the children?
 

Iraq Bruin

Ad Honorem
Oct 2010
5,195
DC
I agree, they mostly are. But if one knows that some are taught otherwise by racist parents, is it so bad to reinforce that natural tendency to be fine with each other?



I wonder too. I suspect the concern for (colour-blind) equality has become mixed up, for some people, with ideas of identity.
I like your phrase "treat each individual with respect and deal with merit and character."

If by 'loaded statement' you meant the 'Good for you', I agree that can be meant sarcastically, but I really meant good - the teaching that we care all people.
I understand the sentiment about the parents and share a lot of it; I am also cognizant of it while raising my son.
The problem is with delegating said sentiment interpretation to state actors, I do think only illegal stuff by the parents warrant intervention since legislations are done through a lengthy debate and process. Finding parental opinions repugnant is an interesting precedent towards thought police.

I don’t consider your post to be sarcastic, the assumption of good intentions remains a good approach.

The race bit worries me since I don’t identify with any despite government classification (which I don’t voluntarily respond to, unless I am forced with no choice) , My son might ask and I would not be able to tell him otherwise.
 

tomar

Ad Honoris
Jan 2011
13,815
Do you know that, or is it possible that she (and other young people) read reports of, for instance, the UN Global Environment Outlook paper, and recognised the weight of scientific studies behind it. Or if a science teacher recognised that scientific authority and taught about it is that really "parroting politically correct mantra"?


Actually some do, I recall it in some schools where I worked in the past. How generally it is taught I don't know, I agree it should be included as part of the problem.
For individuals it could indeed be a variety of reasons... But it is highly doubtful that millions read these kinds of documents (considering their generally low reading skills) and understood them and had a revelation....
Rather they have been "formatted" to be accepting of these concepts even if most of them likely do not understand any of it...
 
Jun 2016
1,863
England, 200 yards from Wales
For individuals it could indeed be a variety of reasons... But it is highly doubtful that millions read these kinds of documents (considering their generally low reading skills) and understood them and had a revelation....
Rather they have been "formatted" to be accepting of these concepts even if most of them likely do not understand any of it...
Maybe, that was ahy I spoke of 'reports' of the UN paper, I'm sure a lot of people have got a fair idea of what is in the paper and the sort of scientific backing it has from news reports.
Have only those who accept what the vast majority of scientists working in the area accept been 'formatted', have other influence not 'formatted' people to reject it?
 
Jun 2016
1,863
England, 200 yards from Wales
I understand the sentiment about the parents and share a lot of it; I am also cognizant of it while raising my son.
The problem is with delegating said sentiment interpretation to state actors, I do think only illegal stuff by the parents warrant intervention since legislations are done through a lengthy debate and process. Finding parental opinions repugnant is an interesting precedent towards thought police.

I don’t consider your post to be sarcastic, the assumption of good intentions remains a good approach.

The race bit worries me since I don’t identify with any despite government classification (which I don’t voluntarily respond to, unless I am forced with no choice) , My son might ask and I would not be able to tell him otherwise.
I would agree if you're talking about intervention, if parents were doing something illegal that would justify real intervention by the law. We're not talking about that though, just not colluding with parents who want their children to grow up ignorant of any opinions other than their own.
 

Iraq Bruin

Ad Honorem
Oct 2010
5,195
DC
I would agree if you're talking about intervention, if parents were doing something illegal that would justify real intervention by the law. We're not talking about that though, just not colluding with parents who want their children to grow up ignorant of any opinions other than their own.
See, there is the bigger picture I was speaking of. We are talking about opinions and not all opinions are created equal, setting a precedent where the state is given leverage over what "opinions" matter and what "opinions" require tax-funded countering is not something I am willing to concede to the state, it is not about the specific opinion/issue, rather it is about the opinion evaluation that I, as a believer in freedom of thought consider outside of the state's jurisdiction.

Of course, there is a counter to everything we speak of for this thread, society finds a way to move forward even without children lessons in said-topics, progress is an upward curve that came from a lower point in history, it just builds upwards. (hence the word)
 

David Vagamundo

Ad Honorem
Jan 2010
4,439
Atlanta, Georgia USA
Pushing gay people back in the closet is not going to stop the spread of HIV, it will arguably make it worse.
My comment was addressed to John Minnit who said that there were many factors in the spread of the disease. I agree that it is now much too late for a positive intervention against the spread of the disease