Long-lasting national rivalries

Jan 2016
1,104
Victoria, Canada
#31
The Romans and Bulgars/Bulgarians maintained a staunch rivalry from the late 7th century through the mid-14th, in total lasting some 675 years, albeit with a 140 year period of peace in the 11th and 12th centuries while Bulgaria was under Roman control.
 

Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
5,101
#33
What about Russia ? You had series of wars in 16th - 19th century.
For the longest time that wasn't the hate-fight Sweden-Denmark was. It's only from then end of the Great Nordic War – when Russian became the second nations beside Denmark to shift the fighting onto Swedish territory – that Russia became a concern like that. Following 1809 Russia is certainly seen as a/the primary Swedish strategic concern, but the fighting and dying and destruction is after all old history. Sweden quickly getting over the loss of Finland in 1809 helped.
 

MAGolding

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
2,718
Chalfont, Pennsylvania
#34
There was no Persian Empire at that time. Parthia does not equal Persia. Parthia was a different state. Otherwise you can also include Seleucid Empire in that discussion.

"Persian" can refer to Persia proper or to all of Iran. Parthia was not part of Persia proper but was part of Iran. Thus the Parthians can be considered Persians by one of the two definitions. But the Greek and Macedonian ruling class of the Seleucid state can not be considered Iranians or Persians.
 
Sep 2016
947
Georgia
#35
"Persian" can refer to Persia proper or to all of Iran. Parthia was not part of Persia proper but was part of Iran. Thus the Parthians can be considered Persians by one of the two definitions. But the Greek and Macedonian ruling class of the Seleucid state can not be considered Iranians or Persians.
Those territories were invaded by man called Arsaces, of Scythian or Bactrian origin, who was elected leader of the Parni tribes. Following the secession of Parthia from the Seleucid Empire and the resultant loss of Seleucid military support, Andragoras had difficulty in maintaining his borders, and under the command of Arsaces and his brothers Parni invaded Parthia and seized control the northern region of that territory.
A short while later, the Parni seized the rest of Parthia from Andragoras, killing him in the process. After that, they expanded their territories throughout next centuries.
 
Jan 2017
1,184
Durham
#36
Which national rivalries have been very long-lasting--as in, lasting several decades or more?

So far, I could think of:

-Britain and France from the Middle Ages up to the Napoleonic Wars.
-Russia and the Ottoman Empire for at least a couple of centuries.
-France and Prussia/Germany from the Seven Years' War to World War II. The period between the Franco-Prussian War and World War I was especially hostile.
-The U.S. and its allies versus the Soviet Union and its allies during the Cold War.
-India and Pakistan from the 1947 Partition of India to the present-day.
-Israel and various Arab countries from 1948 onward--in some cases, up to the present-day.
-North Korea and South Korea from 1950 to the present-day. I'd also include North Vietnam and South Vietnam here, but their rivalry only lasted for a little more than twenty years.
-China and Taiwan from 1949 to the present-day.

Anyway, which other cases of long-lasting national rivalries am I forgetting to list here?
There is no real rivalry on our side between Britain and France.

As a people, we really couldn't care less about what happens outside of this island.

The only rivalry that matters to us is England/Scotland, and if you follow cricket maybe England/Australia.

But even then, most of us are far more concerned with our towns/cities/villages. So, in England you have the rivalries between all of the cities and towns that are far more important than any rivalry with Scotland and I'd imagine it's the same in Scotland.

No one cares about France and the likes, mate, except maybe in government where they see their rivals as other governments.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
16,969
SoCal
#37
There is no real rivalry on our side between Britain and France.

As a people, we really couldn't care less about what happens outside of this island.

The only rivalry that matters to us is England/Scotland, and if you follow cricket maybe England/Australia.

But even then, most of us are far more concerned with our towns/cities/villages. So, in England you have the rivalries between all of the cities and towns that are far more important than any rivalry with Scotland and I'd imagine it's the same in Scotland.

No one cares about France and the likes, mate, except maybe in government where they see their rivals as other governments.
As a matter of national policy, though, wasn't Britain's goal preserving the balance of power in Europe by preventing the strongest country in Europe from becoming too powerful? If so, wasn't France the strongest European country for centuries up to the Napoleonic Wars?

Also, Yes, I did forget to mention the England-Scotland rivalry here.
 
Jan 2017
1,184
Durham
#38
As a matter of national policy, though, wasn't Britain's goal preserving the balance of power in Europe by preventing the strongest country in Europe from becoming too powerful? If so, wasn't France the strongest European country for centuries up to the Napoleonic Wars?
At a political level, yes, and that is reflected in that our language we have about 20 words (derogatory) associated with France and no other country comes close to that.

But, as a people, we have no rivalry with them whatsoever and I'd imagine it's the same in France.

As said, our rivals are Scotland and maybe Australia. France is just another country among hundreds and no more important to us than say Lithuania.
 
Likes: Futurist
Feb 2019
327
Serbia
#39
As a matter of national policy, though, wasn't Britain's goal preserving the balance of power in Europe by preventing the strongest country in Europe from becoming too powerful? If so, wasn't France the strongest European country for centuries up to the Napoleonic Wars?

Also, Yes, I did forget to mention the England-Scotland rivalry here.

That was Britain's policy from 17th century onwards, however some individual wars between Britain and France had their own reasons for starting. The Napoleonic Wars are different.


After the French Revolution Britain began to prepare for war however France declared war first in the 1790s. After the Peace of Amiens the most of the British public and aristocracy actually received Napoleon quite well and considered him a peacemaker who ended almost a decade of war. During the peace phase in 1802 Napoleon started to expand his forces and had plans to expand and isolate Britain from the continent. He sent fleets to Haiti and Louisiana and had ambitions to expand into Egypt once again.

Britain breached the Treaty of Amiens by refusing to return Malta to the Knights and sent France an ultimatum to withdraw from the Low Countries. After France rejected Britain declared war about 3 days later. The Napoleonic Wars, for Britain, became a matter not only of preserving some balance of power but also a matter of national survival.
So saying that the rivalry and all wars were just due to the policy towards the balance of power is rather inaccurate.

Another rivalry that should be mentioned is the Habsburg-Ottoman rivalry that lasted since the Battle of Mohacs in 1526 until the 19th century. The last war between the 2 was in the 1790s however there were still some hostilities and the last case of Austria antagonising the Ottomans or changing borders was in 1908 with the annexation of Bosnia.
 
Likes: Futurist
Dec 2009
574
#40
One long lasting rivalry worth to mention is the Kannada Tamil rivalry which started in the 6th century with the Chalukya-Pallava War and was continued by several successive Dynasties the most famous of which was the Chola-Chalukya war where probably the highest amount of war elephants were used in written history.
This rivalry only ended in the 14th century with the establishment of the Vijayanagar Empire which was the first time when Tamil and Kannada people were forced to work together to protect southern India against the Turkic invaders.
 

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