Maximum realistic territorial gains for the Russian Empire?

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
16,915
SoCal
#1
What do you think the maximum realistic territorial gains for the Russian Empire during the 20th and 21st centuries are if World War I is delayed for at least a couple of decades (thus shifting the alliance system a bit--with Britain joining the German orbit) and if the Russian Empire survives until the 21st century?

On a related note, I wonder if a surviving Tsarist Russia would be able to win an alt-World War I which breaks out around 1950 and where it has to fight Britain, Germany, Austria-Hungary, the Ottoman Empire, and possibly Japan as well with only France, Serbia, and Montenegro at its side.
 

kazeuma

Ad Honorem
Jun 2012
2,366
#5
80% of Russian foreign policy since the time of Peter the Great has been two items
-1. add more land in order to get a warm water sea port.
-2. keeping the land together while you achieve #1

---
I expect that you kill off World War One, or the Soviets go on a conquest binge - that they would continue seeking out the common Russian foreign policy of seeking a warm water sea port. Thus, I would see the annexation of Afghanistan, Pakistan, and maybe Persia (Iran) would be in the works.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
16,915
SoCal
#6
80% of Russian foreign policy since the time of Peter the Great has been two items
-1. add more land in order to get a warm water sea port.
-2. keeping the land together while you achieve #1

---
I expect that you kill off World War One, or the Soviets go on a conquest binge - that they would continue seeking out the common Russian foreign policy of seeking a warm water sea port. Thus, I would see the annexation of Afghanistan, Pakistan, and maybe Persia (Iran) would be in the works.
There probably wouldn't be a Soviet Union without World War I, though.

Otherwise, though, I agree with you that Russia could eventually try doing this in a scenario where World War I never occurs.
 
Nov 2011
8,848
The Dustbin, formerly, Garden of England
#7
80% of Russian foreign policy since the time of Peter the Great has been two items
-1. add more land in order to get a warm water sea port.
-2. keeping the land together while you achieve #1

---
I expect that you kill off World War One, or the Soviets go on a conquest binge - that they would continue seeking out the common Russian foreign policy of seeking a warm water sea port. Thus, I would see the annexation of Afghanistan, Pakistan, and maybe Persia (Iran) would be in the works.
So they get to be handed their heads in Afghanistan seven decades early? Pakistan did not exist until 1948, the area between Afghan territory and the sea in the north west frontier area--which is really Afghanistan "lite" 90% ungovernable.
 

stevev

Ad Honorem
Apr 2017
2,946
Las Vegas, NV USA
#9
If you limit it to imperial Russia, it was as about as big as it was going to get. It never demonstrated it could penetrate Europe any more than it did and the other powers weren't going to let Russia feast on the Ottoman Empire or the Mid East. Japan, Britain and the US would counter Russia in South and East Asia.

However the Soviet leaders planned to use ideology to expand their power. They really saw the possibility of world domination by leading it against capitalism and "imperialism"; sparking and supporting internal revolutions.
 
Last edited:
Likes: Futurist

sparky

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
4,126
Sydney
#10
.
Russia had reached it's natural limits

they abandoned their interest in Alaska , northern California , had cursory looks at the central pacific and blankly refused to have anything to do with Papua new guinea


in Central Asia , they had their hands full with what they held and their only interest with Afghanistan was to counter the British


on the Caucasian front they were butting against the Persians and Ottomans , there also their main concern was stability in a rather unstable region


the Balkans were an issue mostly for religious and nationalist reason reasons, their policy was to set up friendly kingdoms under their protection


they actually disengaged from Finland and gave them their first real national structure
tried to do the same with Poland but the Polish are un-redeemable Russian haters

on the whole the Empire had reached its limits , the canard about access to warm water

is sooo much a British obsession , Russians just don't think that way .

there was a strong emotional push to free Constantinople from the Turks but it was mostly kept in the daydream section of their brain


As for an Hypothetical 1950 war ,there is some serious questions ,

what would be the shape of the Russian government ?
what would be china doing
would Austro Hungary still held together
Britain by itself would only provide a navy in a land war

So it would be the WW1 as it was planed in July 1914
 
Last edited: