Misuse of the word "Tribal" in relation to Africa and African History

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
3,520
Slovenia
#41
Do you have some examples of the sculptures made by self taught artists from so called primitive societies that you are referring to?

How is the statue expressionist?

What does having a market for works of art really have to do with a society being or not being primitive?
Less primitive society -bigger level of division of work. More primitive more self sustaining farmers and hunters-gatherers.

Click for example papua and sculpture in google and check pictures. You will see some great wooden pieces. About expressionism you can check wiki and read a definition. It will do.

Statue you presented looks more as a funny character from a cartoon than a soldier with a musket. Head and arms are completely disproportionate to the body. But it has a raw power in it's expression.
 
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Ighayere

Ad Honorem
Jul 2012
2,509
Benin City, Nigeria
#42
Less primitive society -bigger level of division of work. More primitive more self sustaining farmers and hunters-gatherers.

Click for example papua and sculpture in google and check pictures. You will see some great wooden pieces. About expressionism you can check wiki and read a definition. It will do.

Statue you presented looks more as a funny character from a cartoon than a soldier with a musket. Head and arms are completely disproportionate to the body. But it has a raw power in it's expression.

Yes there are some creative wooden sculptures from Papua New Guinea but I do consider the ones that I have seen as having significant differences from the statue that civfanatic posted. I am familiar with the definition of expressionism but it does not really seem expressionist to me. I suppose we have different interpretations of the idea.

In the statue civfanatic posted, I would say that the arms are in proportion, but maybe the angle it is being viewed from in the photograph might cause one to say that they are disproportionate. On the head however the proportion of the head to the body, even in western art, sometimes varies with the creator's intentions. The ideal is to have the head take up 1/8th of the body in western art, but one can even make the head 1/9th of the body, if that is one's preference:

Drawing Tutorial: Anatomy and Proportion #1 | idrawdigital

The head to body ratio in real life is definitely not always going to be close to 1/8th as in Vitruvius's ideal representation of a human (or match the body proportions mentioned by Pliny the Elder either). One can easily find adults who are closer to 1/7th instead. It is also not the case that the wingspan of a person is always equal to height in real life either - one can find examples of people that contradict this quite easily.

In that statue of the soldier, going just by eye (without measuring) it looks that the head to body ratio is closer to 1/6th when taking into account that the soldier's knees are bent and taking into account that the helmet would add a little bit of height to the head. There are other variants of the same type of statue from this same culture where the proportions are still quite close to the one civfanatic posted:



It seems likely that they had a different ideal ratio for head to body that differed from the Western ideal ratio mentioned by Vitruvius. It is fine to have the 8 heads ideal as a preference, but it is also likely to be the case that artists from this culture preferred sculptures where the head was emphasized more and took up a greater part of the body than in most western art.
 
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Ighayere

Ad Honorem
Jul 2012
2,509
Benin City, Nigeria
#43
Your thought that tribes do not have clearly defined social hierarchy belongs more to a separation between hunters-gatherers and farmers. But even hunters gatherers have chiefs which are higher on a social ladder. First among equal but first.
Actually the Aboriginal Australians, who did not have chiefs, had some farmers but mostly lots of people living a semi nomadic "hunter-gatherer" lifestyle.
 

Ighayere

Ad Honorem
Jul 2012
2,509
Benin City, Nigeria
#46
In post #42 I mean to post a photograph of a different statue of the same subject (a Portuguese soldier aiming) from that culture, but after looking at the statue again, I think it may just be the same one civfanatic posted, but shown from a different angle. So here are two photos of statues of the same subject that I know for certain are different:





One can see, even for the statue which is damaged, that the ratio of head to body in these is definitely closer to 1/6th than to 1/8th or 1/9th. The arms in both statues are also proportionate to the body, as was also the case in the one civfanatic posted.
 

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