pre historic learned civilization, second urbanisation [no Aryan theory plz]

specul8

Ad Honorem
Oct 2016
3,458
Australia
I'm sure all of north Indian cities are much more older than common consensus. But we have to demolish present cities to find older structures !
YOU are SURE ALL of those cities are older than everyone else thinks ? - so many words wrong with that .

You do realise a whole city does not need to be demolished in order to date its earliest foundations ?
 
Mar 2019
1,809
KL
YOU are SURE ALL of those cities are older than everyone else thinks ? - so many words wrong with that .

You do realise a whole city does not need to be demolished in order to date its earliest foundations ?
what you say is only partially correct, yes, cities can be dated without demolishing them, but considering the thick urban population of india, task becomes extremely difficult, secondly, i dont think any north indian city except few of those for instance kausambi who were abandoned have been properly dated, as archaeologists also admit lack of proper dating for the indian cities,
 
Oct 2015
1,138
India
anything which cannot be proven is a myth or legend, but i think that NBPW presence is an important indication of urbanisation in magadh, they need to find urban centres in magadh contemporary to this NBPW dating to prove this notion.

regards
Words "myth or legend" are not appropriate to re-construction of Indian history in my opinion. Indian transmission of knowledge was oral and ways of recording history were also different.

A better word is "Indian Historical Tradition" which was used by Pargiter.
 
Mar 2019
1,809
KL
here is one for deccan/central india as well, ujjain city seem to date from the very PGW age

1558495036249.png

PGW is dated between 1200 BCE to 600 BCE so dating of ujjain city pre 600 BCE suggests dating btw second and early first mil BC.

http://nmma.nic.in/nmma/nmma_doc/Indian Archaeology Review/Indian Archaeology 1956-57 A Review.pdf

some historians are adament on late dating of indian cities

According to Hermann Kulke and Dietmar Rothermund, Avanti, whose capital was Ujjain, "was one of the earliest outposts in central India" and showed signs of early incipient urbanisation around 700 BCE.[7] Around 600 BCE, Ujjain emerged as the political, commercial and cultural centre of Malwa plateau.[8]

The ancient walled city of Ujjain was located around the Garh Kalika hill on the bank of river Kshipra, in the present-day suburban areas of the Ujjain city. This city covered an irregular pentagonal area of 0.875 km2. It was surrounded by a 12 m high mud rampart. The archaeological investigations have also indicated the presence of a 45 m wide and 6.6 m deep moat around the city.[9] According to F. R. Allchin and George Erdosy, these city defences were constructed between 6th and 4th centuries BCE.[10] Dieter Schlingloff believes that these were built before 600 BCE.[9] This period is characterised by structures made of stone and burnt-brick, tools and weapons made of iron, and black and red burnished ware.[10]
if the fortification is already observed in PGW then the city is dated to PGW era. some historians just refuse to consult archaeology and just keep sticking with their pre determined narrative

Fortified Cities of Ancient India

they should dig the rampart again and do c14 dating for the site and rampart. all these colonial era archaeology were devoid of any scientific dating and were totally based on predetermined colonial traditional dating.

regards
 
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Apr 2019
410
India
People are still determined to believe that Vedik people were nomads and in later period they lived in the villages(like all of Indus valley was urban).
 
Mar 2019
1,809
KL
Mar 2019
1,809
KL
Kausambi has been dated by some indian archaeologists to 1025 BC

1558567047364.png

Fortified Cities of Ancient India

some indian archaeologists like BB Lal challenged this assertion, in 1970s

Puratattva No.11 : Dikshit, K.n. : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

1558567286000.png

but much recent scholarship such as Dieter Schlingloff has reiterated this assertion, no matter what, carbon dating on the site should clear this up

not to mention that its not like BB Lal's adacemic is not controversial, esp his assertion of hindu temple below babri mosque has been recently challenged in the indian court as well.

the guy was known in early years for towing colonial lines and in later years towing hindu nationalist lines.

regards
 
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Mar 2019
1,809
KL
dating also confirms NBPW appear in gandhara regions around 1000 BC

1563565594179.png

recent excavation in the Bannu district at the sites of Akra (900-790 BC) and Ter Kala Dheri (1000-400 BC) have provided radiocarbon dates which would push the chronology of NBP at Charsadda and Taxila to as early as 900 BC
some more interesting statements regarding urbanization of gangetic plains

1563565669732.png

cities already emerging in gangetic plain by 1200 BC mean while, the article at wikipedia peddles 600 BC and doesnt allow this fact to be stated there

https://andrewlawler.com/website/wp-content/uploads/Science-2008-Lawler-Indus_Collapse_The_End_or_the_Beginning_of_an_Asian_Culture-1281-3.pdf

History of India - Wikipedia

1563565892406.png
 
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