Scary and Shocking Environmental Report

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,003
Slovenia, EU
#51
Before I bought the dozen of pavement stones for extending my terrace I looked where they came from. I've put 2 euros more and bought those coming from "here" instead of "there".

I contribute 25 euros every year to the financement of an NGO having a family planing project in Mali.

I look throughly at the programs and the policies proposed before casting my vote.
Not enough. Please disconnect your electricity and live a healthy natural life from now on. Sadly we will be missing you.

Or even better because as a white you are a waste of resources and poor oppressed people in third world need them and also deserve them more than you... please dispose yourself off. I propose a same solution to all western socialists who cry crocodile tears for environment, the oppressed and also despise their own civilization.
 
Oct 2013
14,443
Europix
#53
Not enough. Please disconnect your electricity and live a healthy natural life from now on. Sadly we will be missing you.

Or even better because as a white you are a waste of resources and poor oppressed people in third world need them and also deserve them more than you... please dispose yourself off. I propose a same solution to all western socialists who cry crocodile tears for environment, the oppressed and also despise their own civilization.
Stéréotypes never solved any problems, Macon. Rather created problems and aggravated them.

I don't believe someone is a waste based on his skin color or on the place he lives.
 

Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
5,579
#54
Not enough. Please disconnect your electricity and live a healthy natural life from now on. Sadly we will be missing you.

Or even better because as a white you are a waste of resources and poor oppressed people in third world need them and also deserve them more than you... please dispose yourself off. I propose a same solution to all western socialists who cry crocodile tears for environment, the oppressed and also despise their own civilization.
It's not enough because we need collective action on a massive scale. So while anything anyone of use does individually might not matter physically, at least it doesn't make anything worse, AND it also means individually going to the lengths you "suggest" here also won't matter.

And then again the kind of preparedness to go the extra mile, spend extra etc. IS in fact a kind of social and political investment in preparation for REAL action, the kind that might make a difference.

The real worry is that the mechanisms for political action isn't there yet. But it might still come from below, with enough people demanding it, rather than from above, with authorities imposing it.

You just seem to be advocating total passivity.
 

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,003
Slovenia, EU
#55
It's not enough because we need collective action on a massive scale. So while anything anyone of use does individually might not matter physically, at least it doesn't make anything worse, AND it also means individually going to the lengths you "suggest" here also won't matter.

And then again the kind of preparedness to go the extra mile, spend extra etc. IS in fact a kind of social and political investment in preparation for REAL action, the kind that might make a difference.

The real worry is that the mechanisms for political action isn't there yet. But it might still come from below, with enough people demanding it, rather than from above, with authorities imposing it.

You just seem to be advocating total passivity.
I'm advocating that us westerners represent 10% of humanity and we from EU pay half of world's social aiding, we are taxed to death everywhere. I just checked my bill for electricity yesterday, 35% was electricity, everything else taxes.

While a majority of world is not capable even of collecting a plastic waste. Same majority which is accusing me for all world's wrongs while openly demanding my money.

Others will take their share of responsibility for their states and their lives. I was attending schools on 3 levels for 22 years (8 while working) to have something to live. Everything I see is only a growing repression, on a local level or worldwide.
 
Oct 2013
14,443
Europix
#56
I'm advocating that us westerners represent 10% of humanity and we from EU pay half of world's social aiding, we are taxed to death everywhere. I just checked my bill for electricity yesterday, 35% was electricity, everything else taxes.
And as true as it is, it hasn't anything to do with what we're talking.

If I choose to "buy local", it will not change how my government taxes me.

It's just obvious common sense for me: I find absurd to bring pebbles from 20,000 km when it can be brought from 20 km.

... Same majority which is accusing me for all world's wrongs while openly demanding my money. ...
I didn't saw any majority accusing You of anything around here. I don't remember accusing You of anything. I don't remember seeing anyone around here demanding Your money.

...
While a majority of world is not capable even of collecting a plastic waste. ...
And?

Because others do not collect their plastic waste I should start to throw my plastic waste everywhere too?

Why should I renounce to a good habit and adopt other's bad habits?
 

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,003
Slovenia, EU
#57
And as true as it is, it hasn't anything to do with what we're talking.

If I choose to "buy local", it will not change how my government taxes me.

It's just obvious common sense for me: I find absurd to bring pebbles from 20,000 km when it can be brought from 20 km.


I didn't saw any majority accusing You of anything around here. I don't remember accusing You of anything. I don't remember seeing anyone around here demanding Your money.



And?

Because others do not collect their plastic waste I should start to throw my plastic waste everywhere too?

Why should I renounce to a good habit and adopt other's bad habits?
Your questions are not implications from my post. Implications are that I took my responsibilities to the world and others should do it for themselves on a global scale. If you have a right attitude it doesn't mean that now you need to be responsible for others.

It is not on a personal level that someone in particular here is demanding something from me. it is a global trend that whole world (90%) demands from westerners (10%) and especially from EU. Is someone else besides EU paying CO2 coupons?
 

Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
5,579
#58
I'm advocating that us westerners represent 10% of humanity and we from EU pay half of world's social aiding, we are taxed to death everywhere. I just checked my bill for electricity yesterday, 35% was electricity, everything else taxes.

While a majority of world is not capable even of collecting a plastic waste. Same majority which is accusing me for all world's wrongs while openly demanding my money.

Others will take their share of responsibility for their states and their lives. I was attending schools on 3 levels for 22 years (8 while working) to have something to live. Everything I see is only a growing repression, on a local level or worldwide.
So that's another line of defense for passivity then?

The need is for collective action on and unprecedented scale on the environment, and what you pay for anything is effectively immaterial. Just like what DT might or might not do to try to source stuff locally doesn't really amount to effective action. (Except maybe it sort of prepares at least him FOR some kine of collective action re the environment, IF a formula to be applied on the requisite scale can be found.)

Or is it that you first want a personal fix making you richer and more secure?

That IS after all currently ANOTHER major political challenge all over the western world – too much crap flowing to the top 1-10%, with everyone else increasingly squeezed. But pitting them against each other is still a false dichotomy (mostly favouring that already landed and propertied 1-10%). It's not as if your costs for anything is likely to go down if we collectively end up burning down the world for not taking evasive actions in time. It certainly won't ensure anyone's safety.

Though what is true is that it MIGHT actually be a good idea to tackle both the growing inequalities and opportunities AND the environmental challenge at the same time – a new kind of revolutionary development with antecedants back to the French revolution... (Not least since the super-rich are already taking steps in how they might survive an environmental apocalypse, rather than channel funds and thinking into how to avoid or at least mitigate one; a kind of "environmental privilege system" being set up.)
 

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,003
Slovenia, EU
#59
Please all you would be good-doers, address third world on eco matters. They are more numerous and their waste is increasing, ours not. I don't want to be part of any collective action if majority of world is so unsensitive to not even care about collecting a domestic waste and not throwing it into bins. I did my homework so don't bother me. Basic basics first.

Please spare me with revolutionary mumbo jumbo, we have an experience how it goes.
 
Oct 2013
14,443
Europix
#60
I did my homework so don't bother me.
Botully asked me what am I personally doing, what my solutions are. To which I very briefly and partially responded.

Now, that You took that exchange as some sort of accusation to Yourself, "we, whites" and all the rest, it isn't exactly my problem and I'm not going to deal with that, as I don't have any "white man's guilt" nor any other sort of "Caliméro syndrome".

Anyway, nobody asked You whatever You made Your homework, as nobody bothered You either.
 

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