templar knights versus Parthian cataphracts

who would win 500 templar knights or 500 heavy cataphracts

  • Templars

    Votes: 6 54.5%
  • Cataphracts

    Votes: 3 27.3%
  • stalemate

    Votes: 2 18.2%

  • Total voters
    11
  • Poll closed .
Mar 2012
224
ok i have reviewed the previous post of the templar and would really like to find their ultimate match. and i think i have found it.

so 500 templars in traditional weaponry and armour. MOUNTED on horseback versus 500 heavy i believe they were called parthian Cataphracts and obviously they are extremely heavily armored, carrying their traditional heavy weaponry and mounted on war horses. who would win in this fight.

i decided to use 500 to prevent a lucky variable such as a lance from ruining the outcome. this is a far fairer method of observing who would win.

so who and why?

oh and the terrain is flat, grassy and dry. the weather is slightly cloudy.
 

AlpinLuke

Forum Staff
Oct 2011
27,736
Italy, Lago Maggiore
Finally a suitable challenge for our medieval Knights.

Now, from the Rule of the Temple I get that the charge of the Temple would see a strict group of Knights defending the gonfalon

This one [in the picture there is the symbol of the city of Siena which is actually among the most common Templar gonfalons on the battle field]



The Marshal would be there with the best Knights, who will act as an isolated group to defend the gonfalon, leading the charge.

The rest of the charge would tend to draw lines.

Parthian Cataphracts charged like rams [supported by archers against heavy infantry and Roman legions knew something about, but in this case there aren't] straight against the enemy. The Templars asked nothing better to the opponents.

The squadrons of the Order would have taken speed, like the Cataphracts coming from the other direction. The length of the spears was comparable [between 3.0 and 3.5mt, sometime longer, but in a so tough charge a too long spear would have generated troubles in handling it].

Now, thinking to the moment of the "contact" between the two charges, I have to ponder the differences between a riding warrior and a medieval Knight. Knights developed to the highest level the usage of the spear riding fast, Knights VS Knights, while the Parthian Cataphracts preferred to attack infantry and when the enemy chivalry attacked, it wasn't so heavy. Only in the late Roman age they had suitable opponents.

Anyway, if we take Parthain Cataphracts of the last period, they were as fast and as heavy as the Templars.

I vote stalemate, since I'm not able to evaluate if the presence of the "mobile strong squadron" of the gonfalon had some possibility to change the result of the terrible crash of the two charges.
 
Mar 2012
224
i think the cataphracts and templars will both cause a similar amount of damage. but the cataphracts were raised to fight on horseback. they were a horse faring race and the templar would be more adept at fighting in all cases. either horseback or on foot. so i think the parthians would be able to get a better charge off. their horses are heavily armored and so i think the templars will lose more men in the initial charge due to the lack of Armour on their horses compared to the phracts. so id say the cataphracts would lose maybe 70 or so men. the templars would lose about 100 - 120 men in the charge. then the cataphracts would have a small numerical superiority. i believe they would be more adept at fighting in hand to hand combat on horseback and so i voted for the cataphracts. the main thing they have going for them is their experience and Armour on horseback.
 
Mar 2012
224
here is a video from one of my favourite t.v series.
this video shows the battle of carhae. utilizing rome total war. the game i own lol.
anyway this video demonstrates parthian brilliance and the power of the cavalry.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b61XHRfFQmk]Battle of Carrhae (Part 1/3) - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKQ2Abc55j8&feature=relmfu]Battle of Carrhae (Part 2/3) - YouTube[/ame]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=69_Rc_EYlQA&feature=relmfu]Battle of Carrhae (Part 3/3) - YouTube[/ame]

hope you enjoyed it ;)
 

AlpinLuke

Forum Staff
Oct 2011
27,736
Italy, Lago Maggiore
Due to the Templar's use of stirrupped cavalry, Templars easily.
:cool: You are right!

Mindless I am: Parthian Cataphracts were protected from the launch of weapons, the impact of a spear during a charge was devastating for them.

They had to use a arm to keep in some way the body of the horse, not to fall dawn. Templars with the feet in the stirrups had free arms to use the spear and the shield. And they absorbed better the violence of the impact.

Later, Cataphracts had stirrups [but already in Byzantine period].

This changes the result, no doubt: the first line of the Templars wins the charge and then the Cataphracts can rely only on the mess to force the Knights to dismount and fight on their feet.
 
Mar 2012
598
New York
I voted stalemate. A lot of this would come down to whether or not these were the veterans and best units, or the newest and youngest