The Anglo Saxons were worse than the vikings.

Nov 2008
1,155
England
Most of the smaller early kingdoms have disapeared by the time of Offa, and some appear to have moved northwards. The names Spalda and Lindesfarona appear north of the Humber on Spaldington Moor and on Lindesfarne, hypothesised by some to indicate that, whilst some tribes migrated further west in Britain, others migrated north, via the sea. Overall the numbers are higher and over several generations.
The scholar, Steven Basset, likened the disappearance of the little folkdoms in terms of a knock out competition like the run up to the FA Cup Final. The little teams are progressively knocked out until the eve of the Cup Final sees Mercia as the favourite. However, serious crowd trouble in the eastern half of England throws the Mercians right off the game. And so the underdogs, the West Saxon team, through blatant gamesmanship and scoring fewer own goals, win the final game and carry off the trophy which is the united kingdom of England.
 
Likes: authun
Nov 2008
1,155
England
Nonetheless, there are southern Scandinavians, from the south of Norway and from the south of Sweden amongst the early angles. If you can get it, see John Hines, "The Scandinavian character of Anglian England in the pre-Viking period". The boat burial and artefacts found at Sutton Hoo are characteristic of the pre viking Vendel period in Sweden, around Valsgarde and the first runes in England are typical of those from southern scandinavia. Also brooches, buckles etc.
I have just started to read Stephen Pollington`s book on Anglo-Saxon heathenism, The Elder Gods, and he suggests there was a fairly strong input of Scandinavian influence amongst the early Angle settlers. It is a serious academic work, not the usual "New Age" stuff you see on Bookshop shelves.
 
Aug 2011
4,867
The scholar, Steven Basset, likened the disappearance of the little folkdoms in terms of a knock out competition like the run up to the FA Cup Final. The little teams are progressively knocked out until the eve of the Cup Final sees Mercia as the favourite. However, serious crowd trouble in the eastern half of England throws the Mercians right off the game. And so the underdogs, the West Saxon team, through blatant gamesmanship and scoring fewer own goals, win the final game and carry off the trophy which is the united kingdom of England.
I think that once there were enough settled groups, it is almost inevitable that some would want to dominate the others, for the purpose of extracting tribute or securing alliances. Syemon of Durham wrote that Ida the Flamebearer, the founder of the Anglian kingdom of Bernicia, first made landfall at Flamborough in Deira, but was driven out by the local anglians. He is then supposed to have sailed up the Tees and Tyne to seek somewhere to settle before he finally arrived at the Farne islands. If there is any truth in any of this, he and his men would have been mid 6th century settlers and possibly refugees from the cold spell in southern Scandinavia.
 
Aug 2011
4,867
I have just started to read Stephen Pollington`s book on Anglo-Saxon heathenism, The Elder Gods, and he suggests there was a fairly strong input of Scandinavian influence amongst the early Angle settlers. It is a serious academic work, not the usual "New Age" stuff you see on Bookshop shelves.
Stephen made his reputation though his knowledge of Old English. He is not an academic, but he is well versed in the OE scripts and languages. His friend Paul Mortimer is known for his interest in King Raedwald of Sutton Hoo. Paul has commissioned many excellent replicas of the finds there which are displayed at the museum. Stephen's views are formed through his work on the OE texts.

For a multidisciplinary work, see if you can get a copy of David Wilson's Anglo Saxon Paganism. Ignore that price for a used copy, Amazon does this sometimes. It's a rare book but it's not THAT rare. The price just reflects the fact that no one is selling their copy at the moment. You can find copies in places like ABE Books at normal prices. I saw one at Oxfam online for £40. There are even some pdf downloads available. It's a thin book though because as Wilson points out, there is little knowledge of authentic anglo saxon paganism.
 
Aug 2011
4,867
West Heslerton was a multidiciplinary study and the author, Janet Montgomery writes: "For many researchers, the settlement by considerable numbers of Scandinavian and Germanic peoples is an unavoidable conclusion (Härke 1990; Hills 1999, 22; Hines 1984; Welch 1992)." The archaeology reveals not only items suh as wrist clasps but also cloth with a distinctive scaninavian braid.
 
Aug 2011
1,576
Sweden
I think that once there were enough settled groups, it is almost inevitable that some would want to dominate the others, for the purpose of extracting tribute or securing alliances. Syemon of Durham wrote that Ida the Flamebearer, the founder of the Anglian kingdom of Bernicia, first made landfall at Flamborough in Deira, but was driven out by the local anglians. He is then supposed to have sailed up the Tees and Tyne to seek somewhere to settle before he finally arrived at the Farne islands. If there is any truth in any of this, he and his men would have been mid 6th century settlers and possibly refugees from the cold spell in southern Scandinavia.
Is there any chance to know what the original names of these early kings were? Ida, Eoppa, Aelle etc feels just like shortenings.
 
Aug 2011
4,867
Is there any chance to know what the original names of these early kings were? Ida, Eoppa, Aelle etc feels just like shortenings.
They look like hypocorisitc names yes, like Siggi from Siegfried. However, those are shortened forms of dithematic names where Sieg means something. I don't know what Eoppa or Ida could be derived from and it isn't recorded anywhere. There are speculations Eoppa - Eppa - Eber meaning boar as in Eberhardt but, who knows for sure?
 
Likes: Isleifson
Aug 2011
1,576
Sweden
They look like hypocorisitc names yes, like Siggi from Siegfried. However, those are shortened forms of dithematic names where Sieg means something. I don't know what Eoppa or Ida could be derived from and it isn't recorded anywhere. There are speculations Eoppa - Eppa - Eber meaning boar as in Eberhardt but, who knows for sure?
Well I don't mind speculations regarding all these names, which also includes Langobardic ones such as Tato, Wacho or Visigothic names etc. I once read that the Ostrogothic general Ibba could derive from Hildibrand in the sagas, but as you say it is difficult to really know. Up to the reader to make his own research.
 
Likes: authun
Aug 2013
3,553
Lorraine tudesque
They look like hypocorisitc names yes, like Siggi from Siegfried. However, those are shortened forms of dithematic names where Sieg means something. I don't know what Eoppa or Ida could be derived from and it isn't recorded anywhere. There are speculations Eoppa - Eppa - Eber meaning boar as in Eberhardt but, who knows for sure?
We still have alot of Eberhardt here....
 
Likes: authun

Similar History Discussions