The Ideal Post-World War I Peace Terms

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
18,716
SoCal
#1
What exactly would have been the ideal post-World War I peace terms if you and only you were in charge of creating these peace terms? Also, assume that you do not have the benefit of hindsight in this scenario.

I myself will provide my own thoughts on this a little later; I need to do more research first.
 

WeisSaul

Ad Honorem
Mar 2012
2,836
New Amsterdam
#3
Ideal for who?

For Germany ideal would be keeping West Prussia, Posen, and being allowed to annex German Austria (Austria and th Sudetenland).
For Hungary borders like those it had during WWII would be preferable.

For the entente a harsher peace is required. The historic conundrum of Versailles was that it was harsh enough to guarantee German revanchism but too lenient to keep Germany down. Plus Italy and Japan, who were victors, didn't get what they felt they deserved.

To keep Germany down, break off Bavaria (which had a sizable Bavarian nationalist minority) and hand over more bits and pieces to Germany's neighbors.

France gets Saar and Kehl.
Denmark gets South Schleswig.
Poland gets all of Upper Silesia, Danzig, Southern East Prussia (regardless of plebiscite), and a bit more of Pommerania for a longer coastline.
Luxembourg gets Neuburg and Trier.
Britain gets Heligoland
Belgium gets a little more too

To satisfy Japan let them keep Qingdao and pass a racial equality clause. The latter likely won't happen because of Archsegregationist Woodrow Wilson and the Australians.

Italy needs to satisfied too.

Split Kamerun 3 ways instead of 2. Britain gets what it got. France gets NeuKamerun, and Italy gets the rest.
Give Italy everything it historically got in Libya + the Aozou strip.
Give Italy Fiume and partition Dalmatia between Yugoslavia and Italy rather than just giving it to Yugoslavia so that the Italian majority bits are Italian.
Let Italy have a protectorate over Albania and directly annex Vlore.
Let Italy have some Anatolian Peninsulas near the Dodecanese. Something they can easily hold on to against the Turks.
Let them have more Kenyan land for Italian Somaliland (more than just Jubaland).
Give Italy a free hand in settling border disputes with Ethiopia so long as additional annexations outside of disputed lands are minor.
Let Italian be an optional language of instruction in Maltese and Tunisian schools.

Additionally the loopholes that allowed for Germany to improve its military and escape some of the debts historically have to be dealt with.


These conditions prevent Italy and Japan from feeling as cheated and keep the Germans down thus preventing another war. We might feel bad for Germany but nobody else (except for perhaps some British and American observers) feels that bad.
 
Apr 2012
615
Ἀντιόχει&
#4
Ideal for who?
For the entente a harsher peace is required. The historic conundrum of Versailles was that it was harsh enough to guarantee German revanchism but too lenient to keep Germany down. Plus Italy and Japan, who were victors, didn't get what they felt they deserved.

To keep Germany down, break off Bavaria (which had a sizable Bavarian nationalist minority) and hand over more bits and pieces to Germany's neighbors.
The more you humiliate people the more they become bloodthirsty and eager for revenge. Lunatics like Hitler do not rise to power in stable countries unless there is a coup involved.
Too harsh conditions imposed on Germany is one of the main reasons for the rise of Nazism.

One either utterly annihilates its enemy or treats them fairly.
Germany's treatment was somewhat in between, leaning towards annihilation, but not quite getting there.
 
Jun 2014
45
Kingdom of iliria,Macedonia,Epiri
#5
Ideal for who?

For Germany ideal would be keeping West Prussia, Posen, and being allowed to annex German Austria (Austria and th Sudetenland).
For Hungary borders like those it had during WWII would be preferable.

For the entente a harsher peace is required. The historic conundrum of Versailles was that it was harsh enough to guarantee German revanchism but too lenient to keep Germany down. Plus Italy and Japan, who were victors, didn't get what they felt they deserved.

To keep Germany down, break off Bavaria (which had a sizable Bavarian nationalist minority) and hand over more bits and pieces to Germany's neighbors.

France gets Saar and Kehl.
Denmark gets South Schleswig.
Poland gets all of Upper Silesia, Danzig, Southern East Prussia (regardless of plebiscite), and a bit more of Pommerania for a longer coastline.
Luxembourg gets Neuburg and Trier.
Britain gets Heligoland
Belgium gets a little more too

To satisfy Japan let them keep Qingdao and pass a racial equality clause. The latter likely won't happen because of Archsegregationist Woodrow Wilson and the Australians.

Italy needs to satisfied too.

Split Kamerun 3 ways instead of 2. Britain gets what it got. France gets NeuKamerun, and Italy gets the rest.
Give Italy everything it historically got in Libya + the Aozou strip.
Give Italy Fiume and partition Dalmatia between Yugoslavia and Italy rather than just giving it to Yugoslavia so that the Italian majority bits are Italian.
Let Italy have a protectorate over Albania and directly annex Vlore.
Let Italy have some Anatolian Peninsulas near the Dodecanese. Something they can easily hold on to against the Turks.
Let them have more Kenyan land for Italian Somaliland (more than just Jubaland).
Give Italy a free hand in settling border disputes with Ethiopia so long as additional annexations outside of disputed lands are minor.
Let Italian be an optional language of instruction in Maltese and Tunisian schools.

Additionally the loopholes that allowed for Germany to improve its military and escape some of the debts historically have to be dealt with.


These conditions prevent Italy and Japan from feeling as cheated and keep the Germans down thus preventing another war. We might feel bad for Germany but nobody else (except for perhaps some British and American observers) feels that bad.
[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vlora_War]Vlora War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
 

Rodger

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,996
US
#7
Germany had imperialistic designs, but were they any more than the other nations, especially those who expanded throughout the 19th century? A harsh settlement upon Germany would have likely led to a future conflict, so the loss of its eastern territory, Alsace-Lorraine and some sort monetary compensation would have been fair. It seems the other Central Powers suffered their own natural consequences (dissolution) and that should have been better supported by the victors. Perhaps the Allies should have found another solution for the Middle East, as we are still paying for those arbitrary configurations.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
18,716
SoCal
#9
Please let me try giving this a shot:

-Trentino and South Tyrol are given to Italy without a plebiscite for strategic/defensive reasons
-The Sudetenland is given to Czechoslovakia for the same reasons
-Alsace-Lorraine is either returned to France without a plebiscite (since the initial several Reichstag elections in Alsace-Lorraine after 1871 might be considered de facto plebiscites which resulted in an overwhelmingly pro-France vote) or a sovereignty plebiscite is held in Alsace-Lorraine
-The Polish corridor is given to Poland without a plebiscite in order to give Poland access to the sea
-At least a part of western Thrace is retained by Bulgaria without a plebiscite in order to give Bulgaria access to the Aegean Sea
-Hungary's borders should be drawn according to linguistic/ethnic lines (see here: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-o7C34slrA...rI/4-SnTc20VYU/s1600/Trianon_consequences.png), with the exception of northern Transylvania, where a plebiscite will be held (since in order to give Hungarian-majority areas of it to Hungary, one must also give some Romanian-majority areas to Hungary)
-Danzig will be an independent city-state for 20-30 years, after which point a plebiscite will be held to determine whether or not it should unify with Germany. This will give Poland enough time to build its own seaport.
-Austria will be allowed to hold a plebiscite on unifying with Germany whenever it wants to, whether it be one year or fifty years after this peace treaty is signed. If this plebiscite results in a majority of the vote in favor of unifying with Germany, then such a unification should occur at the earliest possible moment. Hopefully this part of the post-World War I peace will please the German people a bit.
-The Saar will become a de jure independent state for 100 years. France and Belgium will be able to utilize its coal for their own benefits during this time period. After 100 years, a sovereignty plebiscite will be held in the Saar.
-Germany will not be forced to pay any reparations at all (France's and Belgium's exploitation of the Saar coal mines for 100 years will be a substitute for reparations for them)
-Other than for the specific areas listed above (the Sudetenland, South Tyrol, et cetera), a sovereignty plebiscite will be held wherever one is demanded (assuming that it is possible to hold such a plebiscite there).
-The Rhineland will be permanently demilitarized
-Germany will have restrictions on the size of its army and of its navy
-National/Country borders which are new should generally be drawn according to ethnic/linguistic lines, with plebiscites if requested, and with certain exceptions to this rule listed above

There--did I miss anything here? I did not use hindsight here at all, and I wanted to create a peace which is relatively fair for Germany but also one which protects the interests and the needs of the victorious Allied powers of World War I.
 
Jun 2013
6,386
USA
#10
What exactly would have been the ideal post-World War I peace terms if you and only you were in charge of creating these peace terms? Also, assume that you do not have the benefit of hindsight in this scenario.

I myself will provide my own thoughts on this a little later; I need to do more research first.
For Bulgaria: Same as the Treaty of Neuilly Sur-Seine
For Austria-Hungary: Give each ethical group its homeland and divide it upon ethical boundaries.
Ottoman Empire: Create a single Arab state up to the modern-day northern borders of Syria and Iraq, but give France Lebanon and Britain Israel
Germany: Remove their colonies, half their navy, give them half of the reparations of our timeline, give Poland Posen, Give Denmark N. Schleswig, Give France Alsace-Lorraine.
 

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