The origin of Chinese nation and the theory of Chinese Center

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Closed
Jul 2019
71
hongkong
China mean is a Center country. This don't mean that China is the center of the world. Mean China have a Center. This center is the Yellow River Basin. It is the birthplace of the Chinese nation . It is also the throne of China, and the occupiers will gain the legitimacy of Chinese rule.

The first Center owner is the Yellow Emperor . He invented agriculture and advocates the " theory of Chinese Center", that is the person living in the center is "Hua", meaning aristocrats. The people living on the edge are "YI", meaning barbarians, but barbarians can give up naturalization and become nobles. No one wanted to be a barbarian, so different peoples began to gather in the center. So yellow emperor is the first ancestor of Chinese .

The second Center owner is the Emperor zhou . He invented language . In Zhou Dynasty, invented Confucianism、Taoism、Legalism、and Family name ancestry . They are the real beliefs of Chinese.

The third Center owner is the Emperor Qin . He has eliminated other countries, unified the words and systems, and narrowed the differences between the various ethnic groups. This process is cruel. so he himself was overthrown. His successor the Emperor Han merged all races and became the new ethnic "Han."

The fourth Center owner is the Mongolian emperor and the Manchu emperor. They are not Han. When they ruled China, they voluntarily gave up their own language and institutions . advocated Buddhism as a state religion, and used religion to suppress nationalists. The strategy has successfully completed ethnic integration. But Buddhism has a fatal flaw. It opposes marriage and childbirth, which leads to a significant reduction in population and loss of combat effectiveness. So after the end of the empire, China’s ethnic structure changed, and the proportion of the Han nationality was as high as 99%.

The fifth Center owner is the modern China. In order to suppress the over-represented Han nationality, China has reclassified 56 ethnic groups and implemented many preferential minority laws. For example, ethnic minorities do not implement family planning, and the college entrance examination has extra points and cash subsidies. But Nationalism still has an absolute advantage. People are more Support "hua" . including Chinese residents and overseas Chinese.

Five thousand years passed .History has go back to its origins.
 

Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
5,936
But the Qing didn't give up Manchu. They maintained it parallel to Chinese for the entire dynasty. All Qing dynasty emperors are known to have been fluent speakers and writers in Manchu, with Pu Yi at the very end as the only exception. And they did it precisely because the had the example of the Mongol Yuan who did give up their original language.

It's often pointed out as part of the problem with the Qing, that they maintained themselves as not-Chinese-enough to allow their imperial dynasty to become a national rallying point against the incursions and ambitions of the European powers against China in the 19th c. So someone else had to pick up the slack of galvanizing Chinese unity against it.
 

heylouis

Ad Honorem
Apr 2013
6,627
China
such a theory is unnecessary.

i think the "center owner" is quite parallel to western feudalism, as china did not precisely have a feudalism system that commonly seen in west, this "center owner" is unimportant.
 

heavenlykaghan

Ad Honorem
Mar 2012
4,513
Neither the Yuan nor Qing gave up their own language. People needs to understand the different definitions of the ambiguous term China in the English language. The Qing never identified with the Han but they identified with the geo-political Central State (zhongguo). The former is ethnic, whereas the later is imperial or geo-civilizational. Neither are nation-state related (except for relating to Zhongguo as a nation state at the very end of the Qing).
 
Jul 2019
71
hongkong
Mongols and the Manchus agree with the "hua". If they do not agree, they will lose their legitimacy.
 
Jan 2016
611
United States, MO
Nationalism is a modern concept which requires a notion of a citizenry (人民). This didn’t exist until the late Qing at least. You can have empires and cultural groups, but they aren’t nations.

Also, most people governed by Chinese dynasties would not call themselves Han. This term was not really an ethnonym until the Song dynasty and it was only used by elites. It took until the Qing before common people would be calling themselves Han.

Also buddhism is not combat effective? I don’t know where to begin really. For one, religion has little to no influence on combat. For two, many buddhist states had very powerful armies. Just look at the Tang and Liao. For three, buddhism is much bigger than monks and monasteries and lay buddhist have never had trouble having kids.
 
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heylouis

Ad Honorem
Apr 2013
6,627
China
the term "nationalism" is modern, and "nationalism" is used to describe a series of modern historical events.

however, that does not mean the people in ancient china do not have a self-reorganization in analogy of nationalism.

calling han or something else is a less important issue
 
Dec 2015
342
NYC
the term "nationalism" is modern, and "nationalism" is used to describe a series of modern historical events.

however, that does not mean the people in ancient china do not have a self-reorganization in analogy of nationalism.

calling han or something else is a less important issue
Hasn't China always been an ethnically united civilization since ancient times even before the concept of nationalism (well, at least compared to other places such as India or Europe, both of whom are ethnically diverse, different languages spoken, different cultures)
 
Jan 2016
611
United States, MO
Hasn't China always been an ethnically united civilization since ancient times even before the concept of nationalism (well, at least compared to other places such as India or Europe, both of whom are ethnically diverse, different languages spoken, different cultures)

Most of China’s population today is classified as Han, but the Han themselves are a very diverse group with many different dialects (aka languages), cuisines, folk music, and art forms. The writing system is shared across Chinese languages, but some difference in writing exist as well. For example the word “little” in mandarin is 小 while in cantonese it is 細.

Also for most of China’s past. Common people identified with their locale. A peasant from Jiangnan in the year 1000 AD had no notion of a unified chinese people. The distinctions between people from Hangzhou and Suzhou were more salient and easily recognizable in his life. He wouldn’t have any comparison between chinese and non-chinese because almost everyone he knew would be chinese. So stating that he was chinese had no meaning in his life.

Distinctions like chinese and non-chinese only become meaningful when “chinese” and “non-chinese” people start running into each other. And even then sometimes this leads to the creation of new mixed identities like Hui (Chinese Muslims) who exhibit some characteristics in common with many other chinese people, but are also distinct with their own cultural practices.
 
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sparky

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
5,401
Sydney
" Also for most of China’s past. Common people identified with their locale. A peasant from Jiangnan in the year 1000 AD had no notion of a unified chinese people "

that's true for most of the world too

old joke
" two travelers are lost , meet a farmer and ask him what is the name of the nearby village
..we call it the village
..don't you know the name of the place you live in , you stupid man
...maybe I'm stupid but I'm not lost
 
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