Was there any other city on the Black Sea that could have surpassed Istanbul in greatness?

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,019
Slovenia, EU
#12
OK; makes sense.

BTW, do you think that Russia could have ever built any cities on the Black Sea and made them comparable to Constantinople? (Or, alternatively, significantly expand an existing city on the Black Sea to make it comparable to Constantinople.)
Because when Russians got to Black Sea after centuries of warfare with Tatars, they already established a power seat in Baltics (St. Peterburg). They built some important cities on Black Sea (they have great climate compared to most of Russia) as Odessa and Sevastopol but of course they can't compare to Istanbul.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,060
SoCal
#13
Because when Russians got to Black Sea after centuries of warfare with Tatars, they already established a power seat in Baltics (St. Peterburg). They built some important cities on Black Sea (they have great climate compared to most of Russia) as Odessa and Sevastopol but of course they can't compare to Istanbul.
Could Russia have decided to relocate its capital away from Petrograd to somewhere on the Black Sea, though? If so, where?

Kiev connects to the black sea and was used by Vikings as a stop before sailing south.
Kiev connects to the Black Sea but isn't actually on the Black Sea itself. Thus, Kiev unfortunately doesn't actually count for this.

Had the Russians not acquired extensive coastal territories from the Ottomans, Rostov would have been a very important city.
You mean Novorossiya?
 

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,019
Slovenia, EU
#14
Could Russia have decided to relocate its capital away from Petrograd to somewhere on the Black Sea, though? If so, where?
No, population centers were all to north. Or it would have been possible if Russia's past has been a normal chain of development but Mongols have broken that, destroyed Russian urbanization and cut Russian access to Black Sea for more than five centuries.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,060
SoCal
#15
No, population centers were all to north. Or it would have been possible if Russia's past has been a normal chain of development but Mongols have broken that, destroyed Russian urbanization and cut Russian access to Black Sea for more than five centuries.
Couldn't a lot of Russians have moved south after the south would have opened up, though? I mean, they were able to do a pretty good job colonizing Crimea, Novorossiya, and the Kuban, no?

For that matter, the US was able to colonize the West within one-and-a-half centuries. Likewise, China was able to colonize Manchuria within a century or so.
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,060
SoCal
#18
Nonetheless, it's interesting to consider what would happen if, say, Sebastopol had a Peter the Great-type character backing it. After all, St Petersburg was not a predominantly Russian area when it was founded.
Oh, absolutely! Few Russians live as far north as St. Petersburg even nowadays:

Mapping Population Density Across the Globe

Also, I think that a Russian capital in Crimea would have to be located in either central Crimea or northern Crimea so that it would actually have a lot of room to expand. Southern Crimea is full of mountains that might make significant urban and suburban expansion difficult:

 

macon

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
4,019
Slovenia, EU
#19
Couldn't a lot of Russians have moved south after the south would have opened up, though? I mean, they were able to do a pretty good job colonizing Crimea, Novorossiya, and the Kuban, no?

For that matter, the US was able to colonize the West within one-and-a-half centuries. Likewise, China was able to colonize Manchuria within a century or so.
Yes, but they were also colonizing Siberia in a same time period. Especially south Siberia around Novosibirsk and Krasnoyarsk is a very important region to Russia. I think that US never really settled anything in west besides California and few population islands and China's main was much bigger than Manchuria and also their starting population if compared to Russia. US got their influx of settlers from Europe, Russia has not. Russians and Ukrainians settled Black sea coasts very well in about a century after Russian annexation of Crimean khanate.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,060
SoCal
#20
[QUOTE="Futurist, post: 3134978, member: 28379
You mean Novorossiya?
If they didn't acquire it and only had Rostov-Azov, then it would have been their main southern port.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. Also, what about a large Russian city slightly west of Kherson--as in, where the Dnieper River touches the Black Sea?