Was Viking king Halfdan the Black an African?

Haesten

Ad Honorem
Dec 2011
2,733
The Irish annals don't say the raid took place in 867, rather sometime before the micel here attack on York in 867.
This corresponds with the ASC, Æthelweard says the leader of the micel here at York in 867 was the son of Ragnar Lothbrok, Ivar the Boneless.
 
Jan 2013
5,835
Canberra, Australia
The Kingdom of Nekor sacked by Scandinavian invaders was situated in the Rif, an area inhabited by indigenous Berbers.

Everything I have read about the Rif Berbers indicates that they are in no way negroid, but rather very European in appearance, with an incidence of blondism that is appreciably higher than that of any other North African population, and indeed of most Mediterranean populations.
 
Nov 2010
6,898
Cornwall
The Kingdom of Nekor sacked by Scandinavian invaders was situated in the Rif, an area inhabited by indigenous Berbers.

Everything I have read about the Rif Berbers indicates that they are in no way negroid, but rather very European in appearance, with an incidence of blondism that is appreciably higher than that of any other North African population, and indeed of most Mediterranean populations.
Quite correct my friend. There is in many threads a deliberate attempt to misunderstand medieval language and promote 'blackness', ignoring the obvious answer in this case (and many others) that they are referring to relatively dark, swarthy Mediterranean skin, unheard of to northern Europeans.

As someone who has no agenda for or against any race, colour or creed I find this bizarre.

PS having just researched the Canaries a bit, Horst Uden's historical novel about the Castillian conquest of Tenerife refers to many Guanches as being blonde (and tall). This ties in with their now-known Berber origins.
 
Last edited:
Oct 2009
6,668
Philadelphia, PA
The Kingdom of Nekor sacked by Scandinavian invaders was situated in the Rif, an area inhabited by indigenous Berbers.

Everything I have read about the Rif Berbers indicates that they are in no way negroid, but rather very European in appearance, with an incidence of blondism that is appreciably higher than that of any other North African population, and indeed of most Mediterranean populations.
This is laughable. Berbers of North Africa had a European appearance with "blondism" that you wont even find in a European Mediterranean peoples!? :zany:
 
Last edited:
Jan 2013
5,835
Canberra, Australia
This is laughable. Berbers of North Africa had a European appearance with "blondism" that you wont even find in a European Mediterranean peoples!?
I was specifically referring to the Berbers of the Rif area.

That Berber group, a particularly isolated one genetically, has been extensively studied by anthropologists, who have all commented on their relatively European appearance.

By "European appearance" is meant that of Mediterranean European populations. The anthropologists who studied the Rif Berbers, such as Carleton Stevens Coon, concluded that the incidence of blondism among them, although a minority trait, was greater than that among neighbouring European Mediterranean populations such as the Spanish.

It is not a question of all Berbers having a European appearance. Many Berber groups have mixed extensively with Sub-Saharan Africans and as a result are partially Negroid in appearance.

But the issue was the identity of the Berber people invaded by Scandinavian Vikings, and it is clear that were Rif Berbers, hence in no way "black" or Negroid.
 

jehosafats

Ad Honorem
Nov 2010
2,088
...
Quite correct my friend. There is in many threads a deliberate attempt to misunderstand medieval language and promote 'blackness', ignoring the obvious answer in this case (and many others) that they are referring to relatively dark, swarthy Mediterranean skin, unheard of to northern Europeans.

As someone who has no agenda for or against any race, colour or creed I find this bizarre.

PS having just researched the Canaries a bit, Horst Uden's historical novel about the Castillian conquest of Tenerife refers to many Guanches as being blonde (and tall). This ties in with their now-known Berber origins.
He's wrong, actually. Raisuni would be strong evidence against that assertion. And besides, classical Islamic historians like Ibn Khaldun routinely described the 'Berbers' (a vague characterization for the most part) as descendents of Ham.

Read Ibn García's Shuubiyya Letter or the Latin Chronicle of 754. When the Berbers thwarted the Caliph's Syrian host in the mid-8th century, they didn't flee in terror because the Berbers were 'relatively' dark. No - they made explicit reference to them being black - and there's enough pictorial evidence to buttress these remarks. Moreover, 'swarthy' skinned people were not unknown to Northern Europeans.

And you're completely wrong regarding the Guanches, who physical anthropology has shown were actually quite diverse.
 
Nov 2018
150
Osterburg
Dear Mr. Ansgar,

Blar is a reference to Africans and is completely different than the words Svart, Swart, Schwarz, Tawny.
Svart is a reference to Black Men and not Africans, more or less referring to multiracial blacks also known as Mohrenweiss (African and White mixed).
If you look at the region again you'll notice a very large area called Bessarabia, within Bessarabia is Blokumannland.
The Svartr living in Blokumannland are also called Blokumenn as well as Vlachs (Welsh). This area stretched from
Kazakhstan to the FrankReich (upper France). Light skinned blacks were called Maor.
In Bavaria they are called Swabians. In Czech they were called Schwarz and Sudeten Jews.
Due to many wars and loss of land the downsized area is known as Moravia
During the depopulation & herding (cleansing) of the Eurasian Steppes almost entirely all
Moravians, Swabians migrated to the Netherlands, United States, Central and South America
by way of Russian vessels and British vessels.
Now look at Afro-Americans again and you'll notice that most are Afro-Black Sea Germans (Moravians).
If you look at Bone Marrow research studies by all leading European medical institutions for Czech Republic, Germany and Russia.
They found that the best genetic match for bone marrow and Liver transplant donors for their region are Afro-Americans.
South Asians are the second best match. Oddly white Americans and Afro-Germans aren't a match.
Now the EU and US are working to come up with a new name for Afro-Americans. So far they are
leaning towards calling the Afro-European or simply Multiracials. The goal is to somehow re-attach them to the land because
Afro Germans feel that Afro Americans should not be donors until their rightful history is restored.


From the article you mentioned:

"It is probable that in origin blár simply meant a dark color, and that
in response to a need to express the hue of a dye, the term gradually
evolved into a basic color term"

"The black color that could be produced with the help
of woad was not a deep black color, however, for it was not until the late
fourteenth century that dyers discovered a method for dyeing textiles in
solid, saturated, deep black tones that had never been achieved before.
Most likely, this discovery caused the dark color lexicon to stabilize and
made blár attach fi rmly to the blue spectrum. Based on the equation of
blár with coal and the shades that could be obtained from the dyes, it
seems that prior to this discovery blár denoted also shades of black."

"While blár (and not svartr) alludes to hel and to death, svartr (and
not blár) is used to describe helvíti, the Christian version of the underworld,
and its ruler, the devil. Svartr is also generally the term used
about the appearance of supernatural and mythological beings, although
blár does occur. It seems probable that also here real color constitutes a
secondary consideration and that svartr is used in a symbolic sense to
convey negative associations. It is worth nothing, for instance, that blár
(and not svartr) is used to refer to black people, although blámenn can be svartir if they are evil or possess devilish traits.
Telling examples are found in Barthólómeuss saga and Tveggja postola
saga Símons ok Júdass (in Postola sögur, ed. Unger 1874). Both legends
relate the destruction of an idol. In the former, a blámaðr biki svartari
(763.28) came out of the idol; in the latter two blámenn hrafni svartari
came out of the idol (791.9–10)"

"Aside from the byname bláskeggr, there is nothing to suggest that blár is used about human facial hair."

"The examples of svartr that have been culled from the materials examined
reveal that in contrast to blár, svartr is very commonly used as a byname;
examples include Án svarti (Laxdoela saga) Bárðr svarti (Njáls saga),
Hálfdan svarti (Egils saga, etc.), Illugi svarti Hallkelsson (Egils saga,
etc.), Kolbeinn svarti (Njáls saga), Ljótr inn svarti (Njáls saga), Plógr
svarti (Knýtlinga saga [ÍF 35]), Þórarinn svarti (Eyrbyggja saga), Þorkell
in svarti Þórisson (Njáls saga), and Þorsteinn svartr (Groenlendinga
saga), and Úlfr svarti (Sverris saga [ed. Indrebø 1920). Presumably,
these bynames describe in some way aspects of the physical appearance
of the person in question, most likely the color of the person’s facial hair
or eyes; as evident from the following, these are the two features about
which svartr is most frequently used"
 
Nov 2018
150
Osterburg
Lol that is completely delusional nonsense.

It’s quite amazing that anyone would believe something so stupid. Like, wow.
It's may seem that way to you but it's very true and this is why the region worshipped Schwarz Madonna as Mother. It's the mother land belonging to blacks. Not sure why it's so hard to believe. Both the Russian government and Duetcshe land have already confirmed this to be the case.
 
Nov 2018
150
Osterburg
Lol that is completely delusional nonsense.

It’s quite amazing that anyone would believe something so stupid. Like, wow.
Well, if you don't like the out come of research you could contact the Czech Republic Medical Reseach Institute University, the Russian Medical Reseach Institute University and the Koln Medical Institute University and file a complaint, then had them your research findings. I'm sure it will get all cleared up within 48 hours.
Lol that is completely delusional nonsense.

It’s quite amazing that anyone would believe something so stupid. Like, wow.
After you convince each Medical Institute how wrong their finding are, then I want you to go to this Moravian town in my home land of Saxony and tell them to stop worshipping a black baby Jesus and Mother Mary.
I have a feeling no one will find you again.
 

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