What percentage of Masurians and Silesians left Poland after WWII?

Futurist

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May 2014
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#2
I'm specifically asking about these two groups because a lot of Masurians and Silesians only got put in Poland after the end of WWII whereas Kashubians already got put in Poland after the end of WWI.
 
#3
Silesians only got put in Poland after the end of WWII
Well, you obviously got this wrong - already in 1921 Poland acquired East Upper Silesia with over one million inhabitants, and also half of Teschen Silesia.

Of course many Silesians - including large rural areas near Opole (Oppeln) which voted mostly for Poland in the plebiscite - remained in Germany until 1945.

But most of Silesians lived in East Upper Silesia, which was densely populated (areas which remained in Germany after 1921 were more sparsely populated).

What percentage of Masurians and Silesians left Poland after WWII and moved to Germany?
In case of Silesians it was a rather small percentage of the whole community. Could be high in absolute numbers, but as a percentage only a minority left.

In case of Masurians I think most of them eventually left. But they were not numerous to begin with (few dozen thousand Masurians in Poland as of 1950).

Most Masurians fled West already in 1944-1945 when the Red Army invaded East Prussia. Those who stayed mostly did so because evacuation got interrupted.

whereas Kashubians already got put in Poland after the end of WWI.
Most of them yes, but some of them remained in German-controlled territories until 1945. There was a Polish and Kashubian minority in Free City Danzig too.
 
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Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
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#4
Well, you obviously got this wrong - already in 1921 Poland acquired East Upper Silesia with over one million inhabitants, and also half of Teschen Silesia.

Of course many Silesians - including large rural areas near Opole (Oppeln) which voted mostly for Poland in the plebiscite - remained in Germany until 1945.
Please noticed that I said "a lot of." I did not say "all." Thus, what I wrote here appears to be accurate. A lot of Silesians did remain under German rule until 1945--though you are very much correct (and as I was already aware, hence my choice of wording) that a significant number of Silesians ended up under Polish rule in 1921. Still, a bare majority of Silesians remained under German rule until 1945:

Upper Silesia plebiscite - Wikipedia

"Poland obtained almost exactly half of the 1,950,000 inhabitants, viz., 965,000, but not quite a third of the territory, i.e., only 3,214.26 km² (1,255 mi²) out of 10,950.89 km² (4,265 mi²) but more than 80% of the heavy industry of the region.[15]"
 

Futurist

Ad Honoris
May 2014
21,200
SoCal
#5
But most of Silesians lived in East Upper Silesia, which was densely populated (areas which remained in Germany after 1921 were more sparsely populated).
Apparently a slight majority of Silesians lived in western Upper Silesia. Also, again, my point above was correct given my choice of language; I said "a lot of", not "all."

In case of Silesians it was a rather small percentage of the whole community. Could be high in absolute numbers, but as a percentage only a minority left.
What percentage, though? I mean, there's a huge difference between 5% and 45%.

In case of Masurians I think most of them eventually left. But they were not numerous to begin with (few dozen thousand Masurians in Poland as of 1950).

Most Masurians fled West already in 1944-1945 when the Red Army invaded East Prussia. Those who stayed mostly did so because evacuation got interrupted.
Do you know the percentage of Masurians who ultimately ended up leaving--even if a lot of the emigration was in the 1950s or later? Does 80% sound reasonable for this?
 
#6
Still, a bare majority of Silesians remained under German rule until 1945
If you count also ethnic German Upper Silesians then yes, obviously most of them remained under German rule until 1945.

But if you count only ethnically Polish Upper Silesians then just a minority of them remained under German rule after 1921.

If you check German censuses of 1925, 1933 and 1939 you will see they did not count that many Non-Germans in Oppeln Regency. Actually the number of inhabitants "verified as Poles" around Opople after 1945 was much higher than the number of ethnically Non-German people in the same area according to German censuses of 1925, 1933 and 1939.
 
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#7
What percentage, though? I mean, there's a huge difference between 5% and 45%
In 1950-1989 (so 40 years) total emigration from Silesian Voivodeship and Opole Voivodeship was something between 300,000 and 500,000.

But at the same time there was a very large natural growth of the population in all of Poland, including Silesia - in 1950 Poland had 25 million people, in 1989 it had 38 million. Too many variables too calculate it - first of all you don't know how many of those who emigrated were Silesians, or what was the natural growth rate of the remaining Silesians.

Today there are 2-3 million Silesians in Poland (rather closer to 3 million - 2 million is low estimate).

I'm talking about people native to Silesia, not just identyfing as Silesian (only a minority of them do).
 
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#8
even if a lot of the emigration was in the 1950s or later?
Before 1950 you cannot talk about emigration of Masurians, because until 1949 lasted the process of determining who was German and who Polish/Masurian.

You can talk about the flight of Masurians in 1944-1945 when the Red Army was approaching (the Russians first entered East Prussia in October 1944, right?).

In 1944-1945 the Red Army invaded East Prussia and East Prussia was evacuated - that evacuation encompassed all of the population, not just ethnic Germans:

Evacuation of East Prussia - Wikipedia

When Polish administration took over Southern East Prussia in 1945, it found many areas heavily depopulated, IIRC over half of pre-war population had left.

Later there was "national verification" of the remainders - those deemed as too German were subject to deportation from Poland, others were allowed to stay.

The census of 1950 enumerated the number of Masurians who were allowed to stay after the end of 1945-1949 verification and were granted Polish citizenship.
 
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#9
Apparently a slight majority of Silesians lived in western Upper Silesia.
Do you count ethnic Germans as Silesians too? Or only Slavic ones? Western Upper Silesia had many areas that were majority German.

If you count ethnic Germans as well, then why not adding all of Lower Silesian Germans to the number of Silesians under German rule?

After all they spoke Silesian Dialect of German, which was likely not very much mutually intelligible with Standard German.

And ethnically German Silesians were heavily Slavic-admixed, unlike for example Germans in the Rhineland or in Bavaria:

Die Verbreitung und die Herkunft der Deutschen in Schlesien : Karl Weinhold : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
 
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#10
Apparently a slight majority of Silesians lived in western Upper Silesia.
1925 census in Oppeln Regency (German Upper Silesia) counted - by mother tongue - 153,689 Polish-speakers and 368,075 Bilinguals (Polish-German).

According to another book that 1925 census counted 543,000 Poles and Bilinguals. I don't have access directly to census data so don't know which is true.

The first Nazi census - in 1933 - counted only 366,000 Poles and Bilinguals in the same area. I could not find figures from the May 1939 census so far.

All of these numbers are much lower than the number of inhabitants in Poland's pre-war Silesian Voivodeship (1,125,528 in 1921 and 1.5 million in 1939).

=====

In 1921 in total 194,776 votes were casted for Poland in areas which remained German after that. Of course only adults over 20 years of age could vote. And you need to take into account that after the plebiscite there was a population exchange and some of Pro-Polish people who lived in areas which remained German opted to move from Germany to Poland.
 
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