Who were the Sea Peoples?

Jan 2015
2,902
MD, USA
We do have examples; the period in question would fall between the Thebes Cuirass (with pauldrons) and early Archaic armour: scroll down here:
The Greek Age of Bronze - Armour
Decorated cuirasses were common some probably looked similar to the dipictions, with patterns of repousse bosses and decorative embellishments imitating the thoracic arch.on the chest, so fits right in.
Careful, Todd--ALL of those reconstructions of "Mycenaean" armor with the chevron-style articulations are copied from the Medinet Habu reliefs! There are no *Greek* examples or depictions of such a form. So you've got a perfectly circular argument, there. Egyptian art is being used to speculate Greek armor, which is then being used to "prove" the presence of Greeks in Egypt!

Only the later bell cuirass has anything remotely similar, and that only has one or two embossed lines taking that shape, not all the way down the front.

Similarly, I've never been happy with using Mycenaean rapiers as examples of "sea people" swords, they are simply far too early for that.

Matthew
 
Likes: Massenzio
Oct 2013
6,262
Planet Nine, Oregon
There is the gap from the Thebes Cuirass to later decorated cuirasses, but continental european examples are similar, as are cuirasses from later Iron Age civs. The Marmesse cuirasses are similar, and thoracic arch decoration would be likely:
The Marmesse cuirass | Musée archéologie nationale
The plate pauldrons only occur in Aegean, from Dendra Panopy to Thebes cuirass, and could have continued into the Geometric.
Some of them wear tiara helmets; those have been found in Crete, not the Nile delta. If the swords aren't exactly rapiers, they certainly aren't Egyptian or near eastern, and look like Aegean or European examples. The big round shields are not native to the area, but are mentioned as being used by the Greeks in the Iliad, as are horned helmets, and now with the tests on the Philistine.. You gotta take Odysseus at his word! Why include that humiliating episode in the Odyssey that perfectly matches a Greek raid? Too perfect.
 
Feb 2011
804
Kitchener. Ont.
We do have examples; the period in question would fall between the Thebes Cuirass (with pauldrons) and early Archaic armour: scroll down here:
The Greek Age of Bronze - Armour
Decorated cuirasses were common some probably looked similar to the dipictions, with patterns of repousse bosses and decorative embellishments imitating the thoracic arch.on the chest, so fits right in.
That's the problem, "similar", is not the "same".
To be fair to the question we need to find this armor where it was used, and from what we can tell this was in the Delta.
Finding examples that are similar in Greece doesn't help us when we are still not able to prove Greeks were in Egypt at the end of the Late Bronze.
Many of those reproductions are largely speculative when we see the small examples of pieces of armor that have survived. And, the article itself even says this body armor was also made of leather.

"The efficiency of the bronze cuirass to protect from swords lashes especially in comparison to linen or leather corselet, has often been questionable. "

"This reconstruction and other bronze and leather armours, corselets, helmets, shields, greaves, swords, axes, etc.. "


Leather was quicker to reproduce, cheaper, easier to work, more resistant to weaponry than the bronze equivalent, which had to be reinforced by either leather or linen.

Dan knows more about this than I, but my interest is really limited to what type of armor those Egyptian reliefs really represent. And it isn't obviously bronze, is all I am saying.
 
Oct 2013
6,262
Planet Nine, Oregon
I don't see any difference in the arms and armour mentioned by Homer and the Medinet Habu warriors; they are identical in every respect, if you take the materials to be bronze and not leather. Indeed, they are the ONLY convincing images of Homeric warriors, anywhere. Recent science would suggest this is more likely than before.
 
Feb 2011
804
Kitchener. Ont.
....
Some of them wear tiara helmets; those have been found in Crete, not the Nile delta. If the swords aren't exactly rapiers, they certainly aren't Egyptian or near eastern, and look like Aegean or European examples. The big round shields are not native to the area, but are mentioned as being used by the Greeks in the Iliad, as are horned helmets, and now with the tests on the Philistine.. You gotta take Odysseus at his word! Why include that humiliating episode in the Odyssey that perfectly matches a Greek raid? Too perfect.
Were you aware the horned helmet originated in the east (Mesopotamia) and spread west. The Tiara helmet (going from memory) was mentioned as a style worn in southern Anatolia, was it by Herodotus?

There is no consistency with the size of the round shield (no "big round shield"), yet here in a procession those shields don't seem all that large.


And, the tassled tunic is distinctly Asiatic.

A close up relief of the horned helmet warrior (Sherden) shows the well known hooked nose & pointed beard of the Semite, an Asiatic.
 
Aug 2014
4,473
Australia
"The efficiency of the bronze cuirass to protect from swords lashes especially in comparison to linen or leather corselet, has often been questionable. "

"This reconstruction and other bronze and leather armours, corselets, helmets, shields, greaves, swords, axes, etc.. "


Leather was quicker to reproduce, cheaper, easier to work, more resistant to weaponry than the bronze equivalent, which had to be reinforced by either leather or linen.
Salimbeti is an acolyte of D'Amato who has a fixation on leather armour. His method of interpreting sculptures was obsolete a century ago. They have access to some hard to find artifacts but they don't have a clue how historical armour functioned. It is delusional to think that leather provides better protection than bronze. The whole point of going to the trouble and expense of using metal is that it was the lightest material available for a given level of protection. It wasn't until the invention of aramid (kevlar) that metal was no longer the optimal material for body armour.
 
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