Why Americans use the word "Judeo-Christian values"?

Oct 2013
13,843
Europix
#31
. So you can´t say Christians have them "from the Jews", you can only say that those rules were and are part of Jewish and Christian education, as they were and are part of the education in most cultures.
But I can.

Firstly, as I initially said, it isn't important in this context wethever others have it, but the filiation: it isn't Chinese, nor Amerindian, but Jewish.

Secondly, Your phrase is slightly self contradictory, as You also say it's part of the Jewish and Christian education.
 
Aug 2010
15,679
Welsh Marches
#32
Christianity in itself is an Hellenic religion with Jewish roots. Jesus Christ didn't create Christianity, this is the religion of Paul and Constantine.

That is both true and untrue, it was developed in a Hellenistic context and underwent corresponding influences, but was also profoundly unhellenic, Paul himself described it as foolishness to the Greeks.
 

robto

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,981
Lisbon, Portugal
#33
It is an astonishingly new for me. Can you pardon me, but I don't believe it.
Christianity is based on the life, deeds and ideas of Jesus Christ, but Jesus himself didn't found the religion.
Jesus Christ didn't found the institution of the Church (or any institution), nor he intended to create a new faith or religion. Jesus was a Jew who lived and preached to Jews. He died a rebellious Jew, but still a Jew. And his followers who stayed in Jerusalem with James, the brother of Jesus, remained Jews until the Roman Emperor sent Titus down to kill them all.

Paul opened his ideas to Gentiles, he's the one that named it "Christianity". He's the one responsible for reviving the history of the life and deeds of Jesus and from his teachings a new community of believers completely disavowed of any Jewish identity was finally formed.

Constantine the Great - and the subsequent "Church Fathers" - were the ones founding the current Christianity we know today. The dogmas surrounding the religion, its institutional organization, its culture and identity, its canons, etc, etc - appeared as a result and after Constantine's reforms.

I find it strange of how this is all new for you, this is something that is very well established in religious studies and early Christian history.
 
Last edited:
Likes: Cepheus

Cepheus

Ad Honorem
Dec 2011
2,072
#34
Christianity is based on the life, deeds and ideas of Jesus Christ, but Jesus himself didn't found the religion.
Jesus Christ didn't found the institution of the Church (or any institution), nor he intended to create a new faith or religion. Jesus was a Jew who lived and preached to Jews. He died a rebellious Jew, but still a Jew. And his followers who stayed in Jerusalem with James, the brother of Jesus, remained Jews until the Roman Emperor sent Titus down to kill them all.

Paul opened his ideas to Gentiles, he's the one that named it "Christianity". He's the one responsible for reviving the history of the life and deeds of Jesus and from his teachings a new community of believers completely disavowed of any Jewish identity was finally formed.

Constantine the Great - and the subsequent "Church Fathers" - were the ones founding the current Christianity we know today. The dogmas surrounding the religion, its institutional organization, its culture and identity, its canons, etc, etc - appeared as a result and after Constantine's reforms.

I find it strange of how this is all new for you, This is something that is very well established in religious studies and early Christian history.
Agreed.

I would also mention that Greek philosophy, eg. Plato, had a significant impact on the religion and that early Christian manuscripts are generally written in Greek.
 
Nov 2017
866
Győr
#35
Christianity is based on the life, deeds and ideas of Jesus Christ, but Jesus himself didn't found the religion.

I think you confused the various Christian churches with Christian Religion.
There is only one Christian religion, founded by Jesus Christ. It has many interpretations during the history which created a lot of Confessions later, and many confessions created various instituions for that they are called the Christian Churches.

Jesus Christ didn't found the institution of the Church (or any institution), nor he intended to create a new faith or religion. Jesus was a Jew who lived and preached to Jews. He died a rebellious Jew, but still a Jew. [/quote]

It develped from Judaism, but it was not part of Judaism. New testament replaced the judaic Old testament. The New testament overwrite the rules of old Testament in every ocassion. Old Testmament was a history book only for Jews, New testament is a religious book without ewthnic connotation, and not a national religion like Judaism.

And his followers who stayed in Jerusalem with James, the brother of Jesus, remained Jews until the Roman Emperor sent Titus down to kill them all.

Paul opened his ideas to Gentiles, he's the one that named it "Christianity". He's the one responsible for reviving the history of the life and deeds of Jesus and from his teachings a new community of believers completely disavowed of any Jewish identity was finally formed.
Jewish identity was not important in Christian teachings.

Constantine the Great - and the subsequent "Church Fathers" - were the ones founding the current Christianity we know today. The dogmas surrounding the religion, its institutional organization, its culture and identity, its canons, etc, etc - appeared as a result and after Constantine's reforms.
You forget that early Christianity spreaded outside of the Roman-ruled World too. So Emperors could not affect Christian Confessions which were not in the territory of the Roman Empire.

I find it strange of how this is all new for you, this is something that is very well established in religious studies and early Christian history.
Are you speaking about your "establisished" dogmas?
 
Dec 2015
3,467
USA
#37
The Christian view is that Jesus is our Lord and Savior.

The Muslim view of Jesus is that Jesus was a Prophet, but not God.

The Jewish view of Jesus is that Jesus was a regular person, a leader of the Christian religion.

That said all three religions of Abraham believe in one God.
 

robto

Ad Honorem
Jun 2014
5,981
Lisbon, Portugal
#38
There is only one Christian religion, founded by Jesus Christ. It has many interpretations during the history which created a lot of Confessions later, and many confessions created various instituions for that they are called the Christian Churches.
You really didn't get my point....

Jesus Christ didn't found the institution of the Church (or any institution), nor he intended to create a new faith or religion. Jesus was a Jew who lived and preached to Jews. He died a rebellious Jew, but still a Jew.

It develped from Judaism, but it was not part of Judaism. New testament replaced the judaic Old testament. The New testament overwrite the rules of old Testament in every ocassion. Old Testmament was a history book only for Jews, New testament is a religious book without ewthnic connotation, and not a national religion like Judaism.
Anything that you wrote here doesn't contradicts my point...

And his followers who stayed in Jerusalem with James, the brother of Jesus, remained Jews until the Roman Emperor sent Titus down to kill them all.

Jewish identity was not important in Christian teachings.
Of course, because the Christian teachings that you are familiar with, is the one that succeeded St. Paul, not the one the preceded it.

You forget that early Christianity spreaded outside of the Roman-ruled World too. So Emperors could not affect Christian Confessions which were not in the territory of the Roman Empire.
Christianity only spread outside the Jewish community after Paul, and they were all spread from a Romano-Greek center to other areas. All Christian denominations nowadays, were the offspring, or were part, in the First Council of Nicaea and consequent six ecumenical councils. All those councils took place under the tutelage of Roman/Byzantine/Latin Catholic authorities. It was those councils that established Christian orthodoxy, and that includes the doctrine of the Holy Trinity, the canonization of the Holy Bible, etc.

All Christian denominations that exist in the world are organized according to and take the doctrines and decisions of those councils. Any other Christian denominations that rejected the ideas and directives established by them, e.g. Arianism, Nestorianism, Apollinarism, no longer exist today.

Are you speaking about your "establisished" dogmas?
They were not established by me (thank you for the flattering).
 

kandal

Ad Honorem
Aug 2015
2,608
USA
#39
Helleno-Christian values can not fit to the real West, because the real West (Catholic-Protestant world) had not much common with the Hellenism during medieval period until the appear of renaissance. Even muslims were closer to hellenism (and greco-Roman cultural herritage) than the medieval Christian West.
The West owes its intellectual and democratic heritage to the Ancient Greece. It owes the spiritual and moral values to Christianity. West also owes a lot to the Roman judicial system. I just condensed it all to "Helleno-Christian values".
 

Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
5,094
#40
One aspect of Christianity in the US is that it's dominant Christian tradition has been Protestant. Protestant tradition differs somewhat from Catholic tradition in how it deliberately and very clearly affirms the importance of the Old Testament. Relatively that means Protestantism has always had a tendency of looking more to Jewish tradition for inspiration. All Christian tradition agrees the Jews had the First Covenant with the Lord, on which the Second Covenant with the Christians is based while at the same time supplanting it (making it a charge against the Jews that they have rejected the new and improved covenant offered by the lord, sticking to the old one which Christianity considers defunct), but Protestantism clearly revived interest in the texts of the Old Testament itself. It's texts are much more central to them than they are in Catholic tradition.