Why did the Plantagenets want to rule France? When they already had Ireland and England to rule?

sparky

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
3,198
Sydney
#21
Philip Augustus father was a drip , his wife shagged Henry and was glad of the change of pace ,
she brought Henry the great and good duchy of Aquitaine
the Angevin were already duke of Normandy

Philip was sowing distension in the Angevin family , not a very difficult task as they were at each other throat usually
never has the Devil Brood nickname be so fitting

After Henri death in despair , Richard went gallivanting in the holy land with Philip who quickly returned back home to plan more mischief
after some fighting with Philip getting the best of it , Richard died a stupid death to be succeeded by John lack-land
by which time Normandy Anjou and Aquitaine had fallen to the French
a coalition of England , Germany and Flanders was defeated on the field of Bouvines in a grand finale of the century
john was just King of England , broke and with revolts everywhere against him
 
Last edited:
Apr 2017
614
Lemuria
#22
It might sound logical for the English (Normans at this point technically; Richard the Lionheart did not speak any "Middle English"; if this was the local language of England at the time) to take over the fragmented "France" before Phillipe Augustus.
Why was Phillipe Augustus much more powerful and effective than previous French kings?
Phillip II was more or less of a warrior king. He had significant military experience and was rather pragmatic. He joined the crusade just long enough to gain prestige but returned quickly to France to manage his affairs. He was militarily very active and when England, the HRE and Flanders formed an alliance against him, he wasted no time and acted against them, defeating them at Bouvines despite great odds. This not only broke the alliance but restored his prestige. The dukes and Counts in France promptly rallied behind him. In other words he took decisive military action to counter the Plantagenets successful diplomatic warfare (marriages and alliances). The French kings preceding him were rather passive. They were constantly losing power to the dukes and even to the pope. They only controlled an area around Paris directly and had no control over the duchies.
 

sparky

Ad Honorem
Jan 2017
3,198
Sydney
#23
the kings at the time were more like chairman of the board of a medieval coalition of rogues
they did pretty much what they wanted and paid lip service to their oath of allegiance
they had their own armies and fought against the kings when it was in their interest
before Philip Augustus the title was king of the Franks , he was the first to take the tittle of king of France
 
May 2017
588
France
#24
It is very complicated because it is a problem of woman.Alienor d Aquitaine (1122-1204) was the daughter of the duke Guillaume d Aquitaine and of the earless Aliénor de Châtellerault de Poitou.The two territories corresponded to 19 departments of the actual France…...The king of France Louis VII was destined to the clergy but was obliged to enter in politics after the accidental death of his brother Philippe in 1131;his horse was percuted by a wild boar.In 1137, Aliénor married in Bordeaux with Louis VII, who was under the influence of the priest of Saint Denis Suger,obsessed by the expansion of the kingdom.But in conformity with the feudal law,it was precised that Aquitaine-Poitou would stay independent until the new generation.It is clear,Aquitaine-Poitou could be swallowed by the kingdom of France,but after the death of Aliénor and not before.Woman very intelligent (arts,litterature etc...) Aliénor realized during the second crusade that his husband was a looser unable to liberate Palestine.So she decided to divorce in 1152 for a reason of consanguinity and to marry with Henri II Plantagenet,the man in full ascension.They married in Poitiers with no restriction of feudal law.How could her sons Richard heart of Lion and John without lands forget that ?
 
Sep 2014
1,121
Queens, NYC
#25
No king of England claimed to be ruler of France (as distinct from ruler in large parts of France) before Edward III. I have read that he claimed France's throne as sop to his ally the Count or Duke of Flanders, so that the latter, when fighting the French Valois kings, could deny he was rebelling. Edward was willing enough after the Battle of Poitiers, (1356), in which he had captured the French king, to forego his claim to the French throne in return for money, and freedom in Aquitaine.
Henry V was the English king who really wanted to rule France.
 

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