Why slaves were seen as less whites by other western europeans ?

Jul 2018
63
North America
#1
Ironic thing is they were seen as sub humans by wannabe aryans/Germanics whipe Spaves are closest to the original Aryans/Indo-Iranians by R1a bloodline...

What was the reason behind demonizing slaves till WW2. ?
 

AlpinLuke

Ad Honoris
Oct 2011
24,325
Lago Maggiore, Italy
#2
Not exactly "less whites". It depends on the historical period you consider. In Roman age, for example, slavery wasn't connected with ethnicity at all [Africans became citizens of the Empire like Europeans, just to say]. Slavery was a condition of inferiority due to a military defeat, the conquest of a territory [not rarely Romans took slaves from a conquered land], extreme poverty ... A good part of the slaves in Rome were whites [many of them came from North, not a few Germans were slaves in the Empire, for example].

Different matter is the ethnic slavery which appeared when Europeans begun to think that the Christian / Western civilization was in some way superior to the others [from the age of exploration to the age of colonialism].

An evolution [or an excess] of the colonial mindset is the racism at the base of the Nazi slavery. This racism was based on the persuasion that within the Christian / Western civilization there was a superior core, a superior race, owner of the human perfection [or something like that].
 
Sep 2012
3,458
Bulgaria
#3
The words 'Slavs' and 'Slaves' are homonyms. They sound similar but have different meanings.

The word 'Slavs' derives from 'Slovo' translation word with meaning people who can speak, ergo it's an endonym. As a side note slavic word for Germans is 'nemci' translation mute people, who cant speak.

On the other hand English word 'Slave' derives from the Byzantine Greek σκλάβο /sklavo, via Norman French 'sclave' and Latin sclavus.
 

martin76

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
5,876
Spain
#5
I should say I lived in slave countries... i´ve been in 100% slave countries (and countries with slave minorities)... from Macedonia and Bulgaria (Bulgarians are not slaves) to Poland (The night the Berlin Wall fall down I was in Resko.. a Polish Village) , through Russia, Ukrainia, Kazakistan, Uzbekistan, Poland, Trans-Dniester, White Russia etc etc etc... and I can say.. without not eve a doubt... Slaves are not only white... but when they are "blonde"...(I know most of them are black or brown hair)... they are as blonde as or blonder than any West European....


About to be white or not... In the world... the White (as opposition to black or cooper etc) is based in the 5 Seaborne European Empires (Portugal-Spain-France-Netherland-Britain)... and we should add Germany-Belgium and Italy from late 19th to early 20th Century... Slaves Powers (Russia, Austria-Hungary, Poland-Lithuania) were never seaborne Empires.
 
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Sep 2012
3,458
Bulgaria
#6
I read here and there that AH didnt consider the subjects of our Saxe-Coburg Gotha royal slavic. Even a quote of him is mentioned 'The idea that Bulgarians are Slavs is nonsense, Bulgarians are Turkomen'. I presume this animosity towards everything slavic is due to the great war. The first world war was the mother and the father of the second one. Bulgaria along with Ottoman empire (reference to Turks/ Turkomen) fought on the side of the Central Powers. Gavrilo Princip was Slav, Russians are Slavs, these are our allies, so they cant be Slavs, something like that.
 
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martin76

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
5,876
Spain
#7
I read here and there that AH didnt consider the subjects of our Saxe-Coburg Gotha royal slavic. Even a quote of him is mentioned 'The idea that Bulgarians are Slavs is nonsense, Bulgarians are Turkomen'. I presume this animosity towards everything slavic is due to the great war. The first world war was the mother and the father of the second one. Bulgaria along with Ottoman empire (reference to Turks/ Turkomen) fought on the side of the Central Powers. Gavrilo Princip was Slav, Russians are Slavs, these are our allies, so they cant be Slavs, something like that.

Good point. I don´t know what is to be "slav"... Bulgarians are "slavs" because language... but he was right, I think.. Bulgarian were Turks.. and Hungarians are Slavs (most of them are Slavs and Germans... but they speak the "Language of the Magyars")... And Romanians... Are they Slavs? And Czech... are they slavs? Most of czech I met in the 7 years I lived there....had germanic relatives!!! Or the Grandmother, or the father of the father of the grandfather.... etc etc...

I think we can say Bulgars were TURKMEN in 11th Century and SLAVS in 2018

Volga Bulgars, who were documented to be Turkic, speaking Ogur dialect of Turkish like the modern Chuvash, belonging to the Eurasian horse culture and converted to Islam, and the modern day Bulgars of the Balkans who categorise themselves as Slavic, speak a language very close to Old Church Slavonic, had been mostly farmers and converted to Orthodox Christianity.
 
Jan 2016
1,037
Collapsed wave
#8
Volga Bulgars, who were documented to be Turkic, speaking Ogur dialect of Turkish like the modern Chuvash, belonging to the Eurasian horse culture and converted to Islam, and the modern day Bulgars of the Balkans who categorise themselves as Slavic, speak a language very close to Old Church Slavonic, had been mostly farmers and converted to Orthodox Christianity.
Would you say that the Spanish visigoths are latin? Because their modern offspring certainly speaks spanish.

Just curious.
 

martin76

Ad Honorem
Dec 2014
5,876
Spain
#9
Would you say that the Spanish visigoths are latin? Because their modern offspring certainly speaks spanish.

Just curious.
Well Visigoths spoke Latin from 5th Century... their books written in Spain they wrote in Latin (not in Gothorum language). Bulgars spoke a Turk language... now they speak a Slav language... who knows? Maybe in 25Th century they will speak a Germanic language!
 
Nov 2010
6,982
Cornwall
#10
Would you say that the Spanish visigoths are latin? Because their modern offspring certainly speaks spanish.

Just curious.
Well Visigoths spoke Latin from 5th Century... !
They did. Tupsum - when you look at the long scheme of things, 80% of Visigoths at a rough estimate would soon (relatively) be muslim and speaking arabic. Consequently some would reconvert in time but many muslims of course ended up in forced emigration, whilst Spain was repopulated with folk from elsewhere.

A lot of their 'modern offspring' probably live in North Africa and speak arabic, if one could analyse such complicated population interactions.
 
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