Without the US, the French (& British) would be speaking German

Lord Fairfax

Ad Honorem
Jan 2015
3,518
Space Bat Lair
How many Nobel prizes in mathematics did the British win for breaking Enigma?
Oh right, Nobel didn't recognize mathematics.

So let's look at Nobel Physics for 20 years before WWII, and 10 years after.
We'll even count "Greater Germany", including Austria and Denmark.

1919- 1929
Germany: 5
Britain: 2
US: 2
But wait!
3 of the German physicists (Einstein, Franck, Bohr) fled Nazi Germany, so the actual result is Germany 2, Western Allies (US&UK) 7

1929- 1938
Germany 3
UK 3
US 2
Of the 3 Germans, Hess fled to the U.S., while Schrodinger escaped (with his Cat!) to Ireland
Final result: Germany 1 (Heisenberg ), Western Allies 6

1939 - 1945
Germany 2 (both escaped to the West), US 1

1946- 1955
Germany 2
UK 4
US 4
Born fled to the UK, leaving only Bothe in Germany.


Final tally of Nobel physics laureates 1919-1955, and how many were working for each power during WWII?

UK - 11 (includes Bohr & Born)
US - 14
Germany - 4

Of the 12 physics laureates from Greater Germany 1919, only Stark, Hertz, Bothe & Heisenberg were able to help the german war effort, the other 8 fled.
 

Poly

Ad Honorem
Apr 2011
6,866
Georgia, USA
Agreed, they were entitled to look after their own interests as they see fit.
It was in the US's interests to declare war against Germany in 1941, but it was also in the USA's interests to declare war against Germany in 1939 - FDR knew it, but Congress did not.

In the Cold War it was seen as really, really bad if the USSR controlled Western Europe - that is why NATO was formed.
If the USA has restricted itself to fighting just in the PTO, then, IMO, one of two things happen - the war in the East is won by Nazi Germany or the USSR, with the winner controlling Europe from the Portuguese Atlantic to the Urals and from Narvik in Norway to the Southern coast of the Mediterranean Sea.

How about that for a nightmare scenario ?
 

Poly

Ad Honorem
Apr 2011
6,866
Georgia, USA
...Germany would have lost the war even if it would have faced URSS only, as Japan would have lost the war even if would have faced US only...

No

Japan would have lost the Pacific War one-on-one with the USA (it almost was anyway) but it is not obvious that Germany loses a single front war with the USSR.

Take away allied material support to the USSR and it is significantly weaker.

Take away the allied war effort in the West and Nazi Germany is much stronger in the East.
 
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Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
6,116
How many Nobel prizes in mathematics did the British win for breaking Enigma?
Oh right, Nobel didn't recognize mathematics.

So let's look at Nobel Physics for 20 years before WWII, and 10 years after.
We'll even count "Greater Germany", including Austria and Denmark.
Whatever for? No country fought the Germans as frequently in the 19th and 20th c. as the Danes. They were even happy to forego the 19th c. distinction of being "Germanic", preferring to rather be "Celts", as long as they didn't have to confess to kinship with the sodding Germans. They are unlikely to be happy with this high-handed treatment. ;)
 

Poly

Ad Honorem
Apr 2011
6,866
Georgia, USA
Whatever for? No country fought the Germans as frequently in the 19th and 20th c. as the Danes. They were even happy to forego the 19th c. distinction of being "Germanic", preferring to rather be "Celts", as long as they didn't have to confess to kinship with the sodding Germans. They are unlikely to be happy with this high-handed treatment. ;)
"...in April 1940 the Waffen-SS started recruiting in Denmark. With the start of the anti-Bolshevik "crusade" in June 1941, thousands of Danes volunteered to fight against the Soviet Union. Of 13,000 volunteers, the Waffen-SS was able to select 7,000 of the best. These Danes fought in a variety of units, mainly the Waffen-SS Viking, "Death's Head", and Nordland divisions..."

Ignoble Danes
 

Larrey

Ad Honorem
Sep 2011
6,116
"...in April 1940 the Waffen-SS started recruiting in Denmark. With the start of the anti-Bolshevik "crusade" in June 1941, thousands of Danes volunteered to fight against the Soviet Union. Of 13,000 volunteers, the Waffen-SS was able to select 7,000 of the best. These Danes fought in a variety of units, mainly the Waffen-SS Viking, "Death's Head", and Nordland divisions..."

Ignoble Danes
Out of 4 million Danes.

Denmark was a de facto occupied country and a powerful anti-Bolshevik pan-European crusade propaganda drive by the Germans. The Danes are a trading nation, not really very Marxist.

Alternatively Sweden allowed the training a small army of some 30 000 refugee volunteer Danes and Norwegians for deployment in the liberation of both at the end of the war – instructors from the British SOE.

Liberation 1945, men of the Danish Brigade, crossing of Jagtvej-Tegensvej, Nørrebro, Copenhagen:
1578937244886.png
Guy looking towards the sky actually seems to be carrying a brand spanking new Swedish army m/45 kpst.
 

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Poly

Ad Honorem
Apr 2011
6,866
Georgia, USA
Well clearly the Germans didn't recruit from woman, the elderly, the sick and children.

How many is that now ?

I understand that it is an embarrassment for such a small country to have 13,000 men volunteer to join the Nazis.