Alexander in Indian scriptures.

[Vajra]

Apart from the mention of the Yavanas in Sanskrit and Prakrit texts,do we have any explicit mention of the heroic leader of Yavanas in Sanskrit or Prakrit texts?

 

[Immchr]

Apart from the mention of the Yavanas in Sanskrit and Prakrit texts,do we have any explicit mention of the heroic leader of Yavanas in Sanskrit or Prakrit texts?

No, we don't. The assumption that any ancient reference to Yavanas is automatically a reference to Greeks is utterly fallacious and has led to the other equally fallacious assumption that the Greeks have greatly influenced ancient India, which they haven't.

 

[Vajra]

No, we don't. The assumption that any ancient reference to Yavanas is automatically a reference to Greeks is utterly fallacious and has led to the other equally fallacious assumption that the Greeks have greatly influenced ancient India, which they haven't.

Pretty strange.Since everyone else has mention of Alexander,including Persians(Iskander/Sikander).

Yavanas could refer to either Greeks or later muslims.

Greeks did influence the Indian astrological tradition,but Indians already had fully developed astrological traditions since the Vedic times based on Nakshatras.Greeks zodiacs simply helped the Vedics to divide and arrange the Nakshatras.

 

[Hamilcar]

I dont think it is that strange as Alexander didn't really venture into India nor pose any real cultural factor on the civilization.
What ever the detail of his interactions with porus and taxiles it is clear that it was very short lived. The later indo-greeks on the other hand had a notable influence and cross cultural sharing particularly via buddhism.

 

[Vistaspa]

Alexander does not occur in any of Indic texts at all. There were two Alexanders in third century BCE who are mentioned in Ashokan inscriptions though.

 

[Vajra]

Alexander does not occur in any of Indic texts at all. There were two Alexanders in third century BCE who are mentioned in Ashokan inscriptions though.

Can you cite the sources for this?What is the Prakritized version of Alexander?

 

[Vistaspa]

Can you cite the sources for this?What is the Prakritized version of Alexander?

Ashokan edicts are found throughout India and local dialectical influences creep most of times in royal edicts so there are variation in names. I remember Ashokan inscription at Shahbazgarhi near Peshawar where Alexander( another ruler) is called 'Alikasuder'. In other places, it is Aliksudal.

 

[Vajra]

Thanks,r-l sound change is not uncommon.

 

[Ajathashatru]

No, we don't. The assumption that any ancient reference to Yavanas is automatically a reference to Greeks is utterly fallacious and has led to the other equally fallacious assumption that the Greeks have greatly influenced ancient India, which they haven't.

Nah, besides indians, half a dozen of other cultures used similar word to describe early greeks. May be the Ionians were the first known ones among the greek colonies. Mahawasma calls alexandria, a yona town. It is certainly not some border indian tribe that is yona.

Chapter XXIX

Search for the key word 'Mahádhammarakkhita'

 

[Devdas]

No, we don't. The assumption that any ancient reference to Yavanas is automatically a reference to Greeks is utterly fallacious and has led to the other equally fallacious assumption that the Greeks have greatly influenced ancient India, which they haven't.

The word Yavana or Yona comes from Ionia, it was a Greek settlement in Asia Minor, and Ionia was the basis of terms for Greek in many culture across middle East and India. In Hebrew Greeks are also referred as Yavan, Persian and Arabic is Yunani.

[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_the_Greeks]Names of the Greeks - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[unmai53]

Apart from the mention of the Yavanas in Sanskrit and Prakrit texts,do we have any explicit mention of the heroic leader of Yavanas in Sanskrit or Prakrit texts?

in sangam literatures mentioning about Yavanaas exist.

ASFIK , Yavanaas not only refered to Greek alone but Romans too

 

[Vajra]

in sangam literatures mentioning about Yavanaas exist.

ASFIK , Yavanaas not only refered to Greek alone but Romans too

Yes,Sangam texts mentions Yavanas.

 

[Ajathashatru]

in sangam literatures mentioning about Yavanaas exist.

ASFIK , Yavanaas not only refered to Greek alone but Romans too

Yes it is. In fact, south had more contact with Romans than the north via Maritime trade. May be Romans introduced themselves as the successors to Greek culture!

 

[Jinit]

Mahabharata does refer to Rome separately. So atleast during the time period of its composition Indians were aware of differences between Romans and Greeks. Considering the fact that Mahabharata also mentions Antioch (which was capital of Seleucid empire during the supposed time period of composition of the epic) , Chinese and Huns, one can conclude that Indians had knowledge of what was going on around the world unlike the common perception.

 

[greatstreetwarrior]

Mahabharata does refer to Rome separately. So atleast during the time period of its composition Indians were aware of differences between Romans and Greeks. Considering the fact that Mahabharata also mentions Antioch (which was capital of Seleucid empire during the supposed time period of composition of the epic) , Chinese and Huns, one can conclude that Indians had knowledge of what was going on around the world unlike the common perception.

but that would place the epic at a date much later than when it has been estimated to be dated at. What explains that.

 

[Aatreya]

but that would place the epic at a date much later than when it has been estimated to be dated at. What explains that.

You must know that there were number of interpolations in Mahabharata. The core of Mahabharata is very old. It depends on what you look at to date the epic - the core or the last interpolation.

 

[Jinit]

but that would place the epic at a date much later than when it has been estimated to be dated at. What explains that.

How so? What is the approximate dating for the composition of the epic according to you?

 

[greatstreetwarrior]

How so? What is the approximate dating for the composition of the epic according to you?

Much before Greek arrival or Roman trade with Tamil kingdoms. I believed the war took place between 1500BC to 1200BC. I am not sure when the oldest written text has been dated. Anything after the birth of the Buddha would be unrealistic as the date of the Mahabharata War. The written text date if your asking about then that could be after the Ashokan era but I was referring to the date of the war (not date of the text) since the epic should not cover latter day Greeks when there were no such people in 1500 BC.

On a sidenote Jinit I find it interesting how Brahminical texts and even Mahabharata tend to portray Magadhan kingdoms in a negative light. Jarasandha and Krishna and their feud. Surprisingly they do highlight Magadhas strength even then causing Krishna to relocate than take them headon. Can you tell me more about this.

 

[Lord_of_Gauda]

Much before Greek arrival or Roman trade with Tamil kingdoms. I believed the war took place between 1500BC to 1200BC. I am not sure when the oldest written text has been dated. Anything after the birth of the Buddha would be unrealistic as the date of the Mahabharata War. The written text date if your asking about then that could be after the Ashokan era but I was referring to the date of the war (not date of the text) since the epic should not cover latter day Greeks when there were no such people in 1500 BC.

On a sidenote Jinit I find it interesting how Brahminical texts and even Mahabharata tend to portray Magadhan kingdoms in a negative light. Jarasandha and Krishna and their feud. Surprisingly they do highlight Magadhas strength even then causing Krishna to relocate than take them headon. Can you tell me more about this.

The epic has been modified significantly through the ages, though the core of it still shines through.

Magadhan kingdoms are portrayed in negative light because Magadh is outside 'Aryavarta' (aka the homeland of the aryans) and also had influence from non-vedic school of thought in very antiquity.

 

[Aatreya]

The epic has been modified significantly through the ages, though the core of it still shines through.

Magadhan kingdoms are portrayed in negative light because Magadh is outside 'Aryavarta' (aka the homeland of the aryans) and also had influence from non-vedic school of thought in very antiquity.

In my opinion, Jarasandha is portrayed as a villain because he was against the hero Krishna. The very fact that Jarasandha is portrayed to have given gifts to Brahmins shows us that the region was very much in Aryan framework. That he was the father-in-law of Kamsa, and stood against Krishna must have made him that kind of character in Mahabharata.