Was Syria once a strong and prosperous country?

JoanOfArc007 · Jun 22, 2024

That was the claim made in the very beginning of this video

And I’ve seen similar claims made about countries such as Iraq and Lebanon for example. I’ve heard the capital of Lebanon which is Beirut previously referred to as the Paris of the Middle East. Iraq as an economic power of the 1970s. Also Libya was referred to as an economic power.

But what about Syria ? When was Syria a strong and prosperous country in the 20th century… was it in the 1930s, the 1960s… when was it?

starman · Jun 23, 2024

JoanOfArc007 said:
But what about Syria ? When was Syria a strong and prosperous country in the 20th century… was it in the 1930s, the 1960s… when was it?

Syria was doing OK economically c 1990 right after the gulf war. Damascus got Saudi $ for its participation--however limited--in the campaign against Saddam. It fared poorly in the 1973-82 period when war damage and internal strife caused a lot of problems. It may have been at its best c 1985--89. Afterwards it waned militarily due to the collapse of its soviet backer from 1989-91.

johnincornwall · Jun 23, 2024

It's relative. Obviously it was a lot stronger before it started blowing itself to bits, with Russian help. In the early Middle Ages I think it was quite a prosperous and powerful area

starman · Jun 23, 2024

johnincornwall said:
It's relative. Obviously it was a lot stronger before it started blowing itself to bits, with Russian help.

Assuming you're referring to the Syrian civil war that's in the forbidden time zone.

johnincornwall said:
In the early Middle Ages I think it was quite a prosperous and powerful area

Dunno…in view of wars pitting the ERE against Sassanids and later arabs. In any event I think the OP is just concerned with modern Syria post 1900.

Girgisjus · Jun 23, 2024

I think you'd be interested in this post I made.

starman · Jun 23, 2024

Girgisjus said:
I think you'd be interested in this post I made.

Economically Syria may have been at its best in the '90s given the trend toward capitalism. But in terms of relative military power it went into decline by then.

Leftyhunter · Jun 23, 2024

JoanOfArc007 said:
That was the claim made in the very beginning of this video

And I've seen similar claims made about countries such as Iraq and Lebanon for example. I've heard the capital of Lebanon which is Beirut previously referred to as the Paris of the Middle East. Iraq as an economic power of the 1970s. Also Libya was referred to as an economic power.

But what about Syria ? When was Syria a strong and prosperous country in the 20th century… was it in the 1930s, the 1960s… when was it?

1982 Hama massacre - Wikipedia
No not really as Syria as a history of off and on internal guerrilla warfare since 1963 plus a major revolt in Hama in 1982 resulting in depending on the source up to 40k civilian deaths. Lebanon did receive quite a bit of foreign investment prior to its 1975 civil war which continued off and on for the rest of the 20th Century. Not seeing a corrupt dictatorship being a great place to invest.
Leftyhunter

Leftyhunter · Jun 23, 2024

JoanOfArc007 said:
That was the claim made in the very beginning of this video

And I've seen similar claims made about countries such as Iraq and Lebanon for example. I've heard the capital of Lebanon which is Beirut previously referred to as the Paris of the Middle East. Iraq as an economic power of the 1970s. Also Libya was referred to as an economic power.

But what about Syria ? When was Syria a strong and prosperous country in the 20th century… was it in the 1930s, the 1960s… when was it?

List of countries by past life expectancy - Wikipedia
If we use the metric of life expectancy Syria was not altogether bad at and average life expectancy of 72 vs 78 for Israel and Syrian life expectancy was about the same for Mexico.
Leftyhunter

Rhymehouse · Jun 24, 2024

Human Development Index - HDI 1990

The human development index (HDI) is the index used by the United Nations to measure the progress of a country. The previous indicators measured the economic development of a country, but HDI examines health, education and incomes

countryeconomy.com

Even in the year 1990, Syria was ranked 95 out of 146 countries on the HDI scale. The Human Development Index measures a country's quality of life by looking at GDP per Capita, life expectancy, and schooling.

Syria was below-average even before the Syrian Civil War. Currently, Syria is more destitute than your average African country. The only non-African countries worse off than Syria is Yemen, Afghanistan, Papua New Guinea, and Haiti. The last time Syria was prosperous (relative to other countries) was back in the Middle Ages.

Leftyhunter · Aug 10, 2025

Interestingly enough just after WWII France and the UK almost went to war over Syria. While blood was shed an all out war was avoided and Syria became independent and was not especially close diplomatically and militarily to either France of the UK in the 1950s and 1960s.
Leftyhunter

Clery · Tuesday at 8:20 AM

Lebanon’s position as a maritime hub has fostered a strong mercantile tradition and, still today, a large trading diaspora across multiple continents, notably in Europe, the Americas, Africa, and the Middle East. That pattern is arguably traceable to its Phoenician heritage.

Syria, by contrast, drew much of its historical prosperity from inland trade, especially during its time as a Silk Road crossroads and later as an Ottoman commercial centre, with Aleppo and Damascus thriving as regional hubs. In the late 20th and early 21st centuries, Syria’s economy improved compared to earlier decades, but prosperity remained unevenly distributed among its communities.

skapeti · Tuesday at 8:42 AM

Islamic countries can't be prosperous unless they sitting in a lake of oil. They don't have the social structure needed for prosperity, usually a small group seize power and reaping the wealth of the land, while keeping the majority of the population under poverty.

Leadership only change with war, revolution and death. If you are not favorite of the small leading group you are basically stuffed in poverty for life no matter of your capabilities.

Those countries don't have independent institutions or national organizations, all matters are handled by a leader or a small group, that's why when they fall they leave nothing behind them only chaos and what is left from the lake of oil if they are lucky to have one

johnincornwall · Tuesday at 10:30 AM

skapeti said:
Islamic countries can't be prosperous unless they sitting in a lake of oil. They don't have the social structure needed for prosperity, usually a small group seize power and reaping the wealth of the land, while keeping the majority of the population under poverty.

Leadership only change with war, revolution and death. If you are not favorite of the small leading group you are basically stuffed in poverty for life no matter of your capabilities.

Those countries don't have independent institutions or national organizations, all matters are handled by a leader or a small group, that's why when they fall they leave nothing behind them only chaos and what is left from the lake of oil if they are lucky to have one

I'd suggest most countries have a well off, leading group. And the rest of us are stuffed in poverty.

Is your view just about modern islamic countries, as I can think of some prosperous medieval and early modern ones?

skapeti · Tuesday at 12:46 PM

johnincornwall said:
I'd suggest most countries have a well off, leading group. And the rest of us are stuffed in poverty.

Is your view just about modern islamic countries, as I can think of some prosperous medieval and early modern ones?

Yes, I'm talking about modern times, In most of medieval there was no real difference in being a peasant in a Muslim country or in Europe

And yes the social classes even in Europe are well defined and watertight, but at least being poor and sick somewhere in Europe the doctors will fix you for free... And then there are benefits of course, that's why they are moving in from the Islamic world.

By the way, I don't think they have a plan, they just escaping from a very dire situation, but if they fail to assimilate they of course will be used as lever in the future

JoanOfArc007 · Tuesday at 10:24 PM

skapeti said:
Yes, I'm talking about modern times, In most of medieval there was no real difference in being a peasant in a Muslim country or in Europe

And yes the social classes even in Europe are well defined and watertight, but at least being poor and sick somewhere in Europe the doctors will fix you for free... And then there are benefits of course, that's why they are moving in from the Islamic world.

By the way, I don't think they have a plan, they just escaping from a very dire situation, but if they fail to assimilate they of course will be used as lever in the future

We can’t get into present day when talking about GCC countries and your opinion that they are only wealthy bc of oil. It’s against form rules.

At Each Kilometer · Wednesday at 12:15 AM

Sure. Damascus and Aleppo, thrived as centers of learning, culture and trade during the reign of Abbasids, the so called Islamic Golden Age. Then the Mongols invaded. The modern XXth century was quite unhappy for this land, ruled initially by imperialists, later by a lion and finally by an eye doctor in the non-historical period of XXI century. Never trust eye doctors, they are evil.

robto · Wednesday at 1:49 AM

skapeti said:
Islamic countries can't be prosperous unless they sitting in a lake of oil. They don't have the social structure needed for prosperity, usually a small group seize power and reaping the wealth of the land, while keeping the majority of the population under poverty.

Leadership only change with war, revolution and death. If you are not favorite of the small leading group you are basically stuffed in poverty for life no matter of your capabilities.

Those countries don't have independent institutions or national organizations, all matters are handled by a leader or a small group, that's why when they fall they leave nothing behind them only chaos and what is left from the lake of oil if they are lucky to have one

This is a typical phenomenon, and one that defines every middle/low-income country in the world (as measured by the World Bank), not just Islamic countries. And "sitting in a lake of oil" is never a guarantee for prosperity, considering that we have nations such as Angola, Nigeria, the Republic of Congo, and Mexico, which are also "sitting in a lake of oil" and were never able to fully transition from a low/middle-income economy to a high one; while Venezuela and Equatorial Guinea reverted from high-income to middle-income status. Countries that are overly dependent on primary resources tend to be extremely underdeveloped.

At least the Gulf Arab countries were able to transform themselves into high-income economies, which is phenomenal considering their politico-social structures, institutions, and the very fact that they are dependent on extractive resources.

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Was Syria once a strong and prosperous country?

JoanOfArc007

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Rhymehouse

Human Development Index - HDI 1990

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Clery

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At Each Kilometer

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