Will we ever know why Rudolf Hess flew to Scotland on May 10 1941 ?

Bleda · May 3, 2019

A puzzle wrapped in mystery. Everybody denied any involvement after the incident - Hitler, London and Hess was declared insane and delusional.
But questions linger..why was Hess held in seclusion in the Landau prison, documents missing
and Stalin mentioning, that agreement between Lord Hamilton, who was the intended liaison of the flight mission and as such, London and Berlin secretly involved ?

The son of the English Lord asks, that documents be released and light be put on the real intent of Hess' mission, so conspiracies finally stop, as to the supposed deal between Hitler and Churchill.

We know, that after Dunkirk, the British expeditionary Corpus were allowed to go back, without being molested by the Germans , who stood nearby and only using planes for pot shots, instead of routing their Anglo-French adversaries on the beaches.

Also, the so called Battle for England was not a full blown invasion, but effort to only damage English military infrastructure and plane fleet with an eye on the bigger prize - Libenstraum ie Living Space for German colonization up to the Urals.

Having decided to defeat Britain in 1940, would have brought the USA and Russia, since the loss of UK can not be allowed and Germany will not be able to grab land in the East and probably lose its fleet, tanks and millions and lose WW II by late 1942.

Were Hess' flight a deed of a lunatic or well coordinated mission ?

Will We Ever Know Why Nazi Leader Rudolf Hess Flew to Scotland in the Middle of World War II? | History | Smithsonian

Edratman · May 3, 2019

Some of the conspiracy theories are interesting. On the other hand, the fact that Hess flew alone in a fighter plane and ran out of fuel forcing him to parachute to safety is a very strong indication that the effort was unsupported.

I'm all but 100% certain the the British knew the correct answer in 1941 and that it was documented. I am not so sure that we will see those documents if they still exist.

My personal theory is that Hess was delusional and was looking for major Hero Points by arranging a peace with Britain just before the Germans launched Barbarossa.

Futurist · May 3, 2019

Edratman said:
My personal theory is that Hess was delusional and was looking for major Hero Points by arranging a peace with Britain just before the Germans launched Barbarossa.

Agreed.

hop · May 3, 2019

Bleda said:
A puzzle wrapped in mystery. Everybody denied any involvement after the incident - Hitler, London and Hess was declared insane and delusional.
But questions linger..why was Hess held in seclusion in the Landau prison, documents missing
and Stalin mentioning, that agreement between Lord Hamilton, who was the intended liaison of the flight mission and as such, London and Berlin secretly involved ?

Stalin believed there was some conspiracy. At Nuremberg, Hess revealed the existence of the Soviet-Nazi pact to divide Poland before WW2 began. The Soviets had been very keen to keep that secret.

We know, that after Dunkirk, the British expeditionary Corpus were allowed to go back, without being molested by the Germans , who stood nearby and only using planes for pot shots, instead of routing their Anglo-French adversaries on the beaches.

We don't know that at all. There are lots of posts on the halt order at Dunkirk, German records show it was taken for military reasons. The Luftwaffe were fully engaged in trying to prevent the evacuation, sink British ships, and kill British troops.

The conspiracy theories around Dunkirk don't make sense because if Hitler was looking for peace, several hundred thousand British prisoners would have put him in a much better position to achieve it.

Also, the so called Battle for England was not a full blown invasion, but effort to only damage English military infrastructure and plane fleet with an eye on the bigger prize - Libenstraum ie Living Space for German colonization up to the Urals.

The Battle of Britain did not turn in to an invasion because the Luftwaffe lost the air campaign decisively. They lost large numbers of aircraft and ended the battle in a very weakened state that they had still not recovered from when Barbarossa was launched.

Were Hess' flight a deed of a lunatic or well coordinated mission ?

Doesn't that question answer itself? As Edratman wrote, Hess flew a fighter, alone, to Scotland, ran out of fuel, the man he was meant to meet wasn't at the location Hess was heading for. Well coordinated it was not. A well coordinated mission would have involved a transport aircraft, a pilot and co-pilot, an arranged meeting place etc.

Bleda · May 4, 2019

Gentlemen, good argumentation. I'll only add a few notes though. Hess' Messerschmitt is not out of fuel when Rudolf Hess is bailing out. He departs at 17:45 on May 10 th, with 2 extra fuel tanks, ventilation system for him specially and other modifications approved
by the High Command.

From October 1940 the chief test pilot for Messerschmitt is training Hess for the 5Hr flight.When a Spitfire is on his tail he takes the
plane from 100 feet to 6000 ft, so a parachute can be deployed and the plane to crash from a higher altitude, leaving less clues for engineers to figure out.

Once on the ground, he asks for the Duke of Hamilton and on the following day interviewd by him. The Duke reports to Churchill and the Prime Minister sends his best German expert Yvonne Kirkpatrick for additional meetings , that continue for the next several days.
After which our Nazi hero(3rd in accession after Hitler, Goering) gets Royal treatment - transfer to a British castle, with medical attention around the clock.

Hess has several internal ailments, but no mental issues whatsoever.He can go in the countryside inder escort, has papers to read and radio to listen too.Immediately Nazi press starts defining him as lunatic, deluded person with those condition, since WWI.
Germany's allies - Italy and Japan are given the same explanations, but diplomats ask why would a crazy person get # 3 job
and fly planes.lol

Stalin is given the same explanation by Churchill himself.."lunatic benevolency".That said Hess continues living the good life in castles, under heightened security though. He is not placed in asylums for mentally deranged. In Nuremberg, Rudolf Hess is acting, as if he is ........ and later in his trial acknowledges he is behaving this way to avoid the death sentence.

When the Soviet troops enter Berlin, caches of documents are found, including official documents pointing to back channel communications - London-Berlin. In 2013 American auction house has to pull back WWII Era docs in the last minute.
Those papers contain embarrassing info on German - British contacts.

When interrogated on his first meeting, Hess indicates, that he is relaying Hitler's wishes for a deal. Germany will respect
the British Empire, UK will not hinder Germany's rise as a New Empire, with borders deep into the USSR.Long story short -
the Nazis don't want to fight on 2 fronts.

Rudolf Hess - Wikipedia

rvsakhadeo · May 14, 2019

Bleda said:
Gentlemen, good argumentation. I'll only add a few notes though. Hess' Messerschmitt is not out of fuel when Rudolf Hess is bailing out. He departs at 17:45 on May 10 th, with 2 extra fuel tanks, ventilation system for him specially and other modifications approved
by the High Command.

From October 1940 the chief test pilot for Messerschmitt is training Hess for the 5Hr flight.When a Spitfire is on his tail he takes the
plane from 100 feet to 6000 ft, so a parachute can be deployed and the plane to crash from a higher altitude, leaving less clues for engineers to figure out.

Once on the ground, he asks for the Duke of Hamilton and on the following day interviewd by him. The Duke reports to Churchill and the Prime Minister sends his best German expert Yvonne Kirkpatrick for additional meetings , that continue for the next several days.
After which our Nazi hero(3rd in accession after Hitler, Goering) gets Royal treatment - transfer to a British castle, with medical attention around the clock.

Hess has several internal ailments, but no mental issues whatsoever.He can go in the countryside inder escort, has papers to read and radio to listen too.Immediately Nazi press starts defining him as lunatic, deluded person with those condition, since WWI.
Germany's allies - Italy and Japan are given the same explanations, but diplomats ask why would a crazy person get # 3 job
and fly planes.lol

Stalin is given the same explanation by Churchill himself.."lunatic benevolency".That said Hess continues living the good life in castles, under heightened security though. He is not placed in asylums for mentally deranged. In Nuremberg, Rudolf Hess is acting, as if he is ........ and later in his trial acknowledges he is behaving this way to avoid the death sentence.

When the Soviet troops enter Berlin, caches of documents are found, including official documents pointing to back channel communications - London-Berlin. In 2013 American auction house has to pull back WWII Era docs in the last minute.
Those papers contain embarrassing info on German - British contacts.

When interrogated on his first meeting, Hess indicates, that he is relaying Hitler's wishes for a deal. Germany will respect
the British Empire, UK will not hinder Germany's rise as a New Empire, with borders deep into the USSR.Long story short -
the Nazis don't want to fight on 2 fronts.

Rudolf Hess - Wikipedia

Not Yvonne Kirkpatrick, for God's sake ! He was a man called Ivonne Kirkpatrick !

betgo · May 14, 2019

rvsakhadeo said:
Not Yvonne Kirkpatrick, for God's sake ! He was a man called Ivonne Kirkpatrick !

Actually, Ivone Kilpatrick.

This was a few weeks before the invasion of the Soviet Union. It is pretty clear Hess was trying to make peace with Britain. The only question is whether he was doing it with Hitler's approval.

betgo · May 14, 2019

I meant Ivone Kirkpatrick.

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Will we ever know why Rudolf Hess flew to Scotland on May 10 1941 ?

Bleda

Edratman

Futurist

hop

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