Joined Jun 2016
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Roman Empire
When did this tradition mostly die out? for common people? aristocracy? royalty?
Arranged Marriage in European Cultures
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It hasn't completely died out yet, but the early 20th century seemed to be the time that more or less erased them.
Joined Jun 2016
489 Posts | 2+
Roman Empire
Local rural communities, particularly in the east and southeast. Immigrant communities from north Africa and South Asia are more likely to, however. One shouldn't imagine this as a significant minority, however, it is very near statistical zero. The Roma are really the major ones that still do it in large numbers.
It died out with prosperity. The main reason for arranged marriages historically is that is that things were tough on new families when they yet hadn't inherited their parents wealth. and even if they had a sustainable income, bad weather, war etc could easily destroy crops for a year leading to ruin and starvation.
In the absence of a welfare state, it was up to families themselves to make certain a couple could provide for themselves and support them if they struggled.
So for most of history, marriage was foremost a economic enterprise rather then a union of love.
As for royalty or aristocracy it's a little different since besides securing wealth it was a tool to strike alliances and treaties.
As for when, 20th century to various degrees.
In the absence of a welfare state, it was up to families themselves to make certain a couple could provide for themselves and support them if they struggled.
So for most of history, marriage was foremost a economic enterprise rather then a union of love.
As for royalty or aristocracy it's a little different since besides securing wealth it was a tool to strike alliances and treaties.
As for when, 20th century to various degrees.
Joined Apr 2016
1,646 Posts | 8+
United Kingdom
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Technically, there were no 'arranged marriages' in high and late medieval Christian Europe (and onwards) because the church required free and public consent of both parties. It was actually a hard requirement to bypass in and of itself. Many times men and women went along for the good of the family and themselves, or (at the manorial level) to avoid a fine and other financial penalties for marrying someone their lord deemed unsuitable. Many, though, refused. And bar attempted financial coercion, there was nothing anyone could do about it. There were also a number of cons to get out of it: plead chastity; claim prior promise; be pregnant, and fake consummation with another man you'd 'married' (for all intents and purposes) in front of zero witnesses. Marriage was really quite a lax thing much of the time.
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I wouldn't go so far as saying it was 'lax'. For much of prior history there would have been great social pressure to marry someone of a good 'station'. Families could push sons and daughters in to marriage with others of the right class even if perhaps they felt stronger love for someone of a lower rank. Even as recent as the 20th century there could be considerable disaproval against you if you wanted to marry someone who was viewed as a 'lower station' than your family and peers (an example would be Edward VIII abdication incident).
Regardless of how it might have been on paper or in Church laws, we shouldn't forget the power of peer pressure in these kind of situations. Edward VIII went ahead and married his choice, but it cost him his rank and position. I'm sure there were numerous cases in history of people who didn't risk the loss of their social position and went along with the 'socially acceptable' spouse their family had recommended even if it wasn't their own choice.
Joined Apr 2016
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United Kingdom
I say lax not because people were laissez-faire about it, but because the standards of what constituted marriage were hit-and-miss and largely trivial until the late medieval. People could enact legally-binding prior promise anywhere, with or without witnesses, and marriages could be held in kitchens or inns.
Families could push, yes, but in Christian Europe (from the early 1200s onward) they could not force. No matter who was behind it, a non-consensual marriage was no marriage at all in the eyes of the church, and barring claims of consummation could be dissolved with a snap of the fingers - as it had never existed. Forcing a marriage was, so long as the bride or groom remained resilient, a legal and canonical impossibility. Back then, this was absolutely not an 'on paper' issue, either. If the church said there was no marriage, there was no marriage.
'Even as' indicates straightforward progression from medieval times, when in fact things (especially for those lower down the social scale) became a lot more restrictive in the early modern - especially the Georgian and Victorian age, which the 20th century directly followed on from.
There were plenty of people who did that. But, the bottom line remains that - barring threats to finances and status - they couldn't be forced. Rich or poor, man or woman, no-one could be married if they hadn't consented to the marriage, whether or not a ceremony had gone ahead and (to a lesser extent) whether or not consummation had occurred. Peer pressure is all it was. Strong peer pressure, but peer pressure nonetheless.
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Sure, that's fair enough. Wasn't trying to contradict what you said about the legality of it or the church's ability to dissolve forced unions, just making the point that social norms and expectations shouldn't be forgotten when discussing this kind of topic and it's effects on people of previous centuries. "Arranged marriages" might not be the right term, but I think you could say there were plenty of cases of "strongly suggested marriages" that went ahead for reasons other than who the two people actually wanted as their first choice of spouse.
Joined Apr 2016
1,646 Posts | 8+
United Kingdom
It's not a bad point you raised, either, I'm just a little invested in killing the 'arranged marriage' myth (blame my feminist professor 
). There are instances of people getting out of marriages for reasons that would shame a modern Las Vegas divorce lawyer. In Henrietta Leyser's book she references one Agnes, who - at just fourteen - annulled her own prior promise because she objected to the pet name her future in-laws' had for her.
). There are instances of people getting out of marriages for reasons that would shame a modern Las Vegas divorce lawyer. In Henrietta Leyser's book she references one Agnes, who - at just fourteen - annulled her own prior promise because she objected to the pet name her future in-laws' had for her.
Joined Jul 2014
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Lower Styria, Slovenia
Gypsies in certain places probably still practise it, just like selling/buying brides and similar. Otherwise I'm not aware of any place where it'd still be done. Like others said, 100 ago a lot of change happened, this being one of them. A 100 years ago we didn't have the typical arranged marriages where parents of both parties would make an agreement, sometimes even for years to come. No. The two in question would have to ask their parents if they agree or better said the groom had to. Then the father of the bride and the groom alone or with company would debate over the price and make an arangement. Depending on who would move where, the groom would ens up paying money or naturalia or the bride would receive money or naturalia from her family, usually the father. I won't describe the various traditions accompanying the wedding day itself, not the place here.
Joined Nov 2014
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It hasn't died out completely. Although , they are more symbolic in rural areas of my culture.
We have many traditions with marriage matching in our culture. Matchmakers were relatives or important individuals in community.
A soup with pig-tails (yes, pig tails) was served during meeting by brides' families. If pig-tails were standing up-right in a plate, then brides' parents agreed to proposal. If pig-tails were floating, then it signified a refusal.
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Man, could they not have just talked it out first?
Poles had a similar custom, where if blood soup was served by parents to a suitor visiting them it meant his proposal for marrying the daughter was rejected.
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Man, could they not have just talked it out first?
Poles had a similar custom, where if blood soup was served by parents to a suitor visiting them it meant his proposal for marrying the daughter was rejected.
Blood soup was also served in much of Belarus. Adam Mickiewicz born in Navahrudak described the custom in his epic poem Pan Tadeusz.
Ukrainians were presenting pumpkins to signify refusal.
Interesting, I didn't know about that one. Did they carve grumpy faces on them?
(sorry, I'll let myself out...)
Joined Nov 2014
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Pumpkin without carvings. It was a famous custom made into literature and classic movies. Probably exists to these days in some rural regions of Ukraine.Interesting, I didn't know about that one. Did they carve grumpy faces on them?
(sorry, I'll let myself out...)
Getting a pumpkin was a humiliation to a guy. Just like getting blood soup in our culture. Some guys were sending their friends to see if blood soup was cooked or pumpkins anywhere around before entering house to make proposals.
IIrc, the objection to Prince Edward's marriage to Wallis Simpson was that she was a divorcee. In the Britain of the1930s, divorce was still eyed askance.
Had she not been a divorcee, Wallis may have been regarded as a perfectly acceptable Queen.
Had she not been a divorcee, Wallis may have been regarded as a perfectly acceptable Queen.
Joined Nov 2014
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Bread and salt is a common tradition in eastern and central European cultures. It's a welcoming tradition to these days.
Joined Jun 2016
489 Posts | 2+
Roman Empire
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