East Asian genetic relationships

Interesting!

Some doubts happens to me. Korean language as well as Japan shared some Dravidic words despite the long real and ethnic distance, on which no satisfactory interpretations has been agreed among even scholaric society as I heard.

For the similarity as example, Hulbert(Homer Hulbert - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia), one of earlist Western resident, published "A Comparative Grammar of the Korean Language and the Dravidian Dialects in India. Seoul(1905)."

Accordinng to Mandschure's thought I can suppose, the similarity was fully imported from paleo-Japanese in moderner times. But the problem is that the common words are concentrated on very basic words like father and mother. Whether the evaluation about basicity was performed fairly I'm totally unaware because I'm pure non-liguistist and this data was supposed to be not corrected from a single kind of Dravidic dialect(Dravidic consists of some 7 or so dialects as I heard).

But the original graph does not imply that Korean have never southern genetics. That as I thought rahter means that if 10% Japan has Southern look, Korea has 5% maybe. They really have so as anyone's country's distritubtion. haha. any way, I've always born the mind that it is very mysterious. Who would give a good answer? And I'd like to see the Mongolian and other Central Asians' position in the graph.

Mandschure said:

The Japanese also have a Austro-Japanese language family classification according to some western linguists.

There are Mongolians in this PCA.

What we can tell from this PCA is that there is quite a close relationship between Japanese and Dravidian Indians.

Yayoi depictions of the aboriginal Jomon in Japan:







According to the diagrams, they look like Austro-Melanesians more than anything else.

The extent of migrations from Sundaland (present-day Malaysia). You can see that Japan received significant migrations from Malaysia, including southern China.

Click to expand...

This would explain i guess. By the coast Immigration theory the ancient people in the Indian subcontinent would have migrated to the Indo China malay archipelogo and to Australasian. The grey colour shows that the shallow area near the coast and this shallow area can be seen connecting the Philippines archipelago Taiwan and Japan. There is also a shallow sunken mass connecting the guinea to Japan with an arch like passage through the pacific. There are chances that the austronesian people once lived in Japan and Taiwan has aborgenial people who speak Austronesian languages

The Dravidians( it is not a racial term) are considered to the the cross between the Austronesian and the ....... group and people with such physical appearances are there in south India.

^^ Hmm interesting. I think I look more of the South Asian looking Japanese man though I must say I am not a Japanese

Haplogroup D* and others markers genetically evolved and mutated 60,000 years from Ainu Haplogroup D2, Tibetan D1, Tibeto-Butmese D3 markers, there basically not even the same thing. So an Ainu with Haplogroup D2 or an Tibetan with D1 are as distinct from Negrito D* as Koreans O2b are distinct from Europeans R1a.

Haplogroup D* Adamanese
Haplogroup D1 Tibetan
Haplogroup D2 Ainu, Jomon
Haplogroup D3 Tibeto-burmese

"
Within this lineage, ale Onges and Jarawas almost exclusively belong to Haplotype D, which is also found in Tibet and Japan, but is rare on the Indian mainland and elsewhere in Asia.[13] However, this is a subclade of the D haplogroup which has not been seen outside of the Andamans, a fact that underscores the insularity of these tribes.[14] The only other group that is known to predominantly belong to haplogroup D are the Ainu aboriginal people of Japan.[15] "

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andamanese_people"]Andamanese people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
Source" Tajima, Atsushi; et al. (2004), "Genetic origins of the Ainu inferred from combined DNA analyses of maternal and paternal lineages", Journal of Human Genetics 49 (4): 187–193,


This is the original:


Notice how it says 'old photos of Japan' on the bottom of the color version. Yeah, that's because it's an old black & white photo which has been artificially colorized.

" In the book of "Ainu life and legends" by author Kyōsuke Kindaichi (published by the Japanese Tourist Board in 1942) contains the physical description of Ainu : Many have wavy hair, but some straight black hair. Very few of them have wavy brownish hair. Their skins are generally reported to be light brown. But this is due to the fact that they labor on the sea and in briny winds all day. Old people who have long desisted from their outdoor work are often found to be as white as western men. The Ainu have broad faces, beetling eyebrows, and large sunken eyes, which are generally horizontal and of the so-called European type. Eyes of the Mongolian type are hardly found among them."

Modern Japanese and European anthropologist and scientist concluded Ainu and Jomon are actually what proto-mongoloid looked like, their genetics and skulls have no similar ity to Caucasoid only their cranial facial appears like Caucasian, they have more in common with Amerindians than to any Europeans, Australoids, Melanesian ect

Proto-mongoloid = no East Asian appearance

Neo-mongoloid = evolved from proto-mongoloid due to adaption of the cold during the ice age.

Japanese = neo-mongoloid with some to little proto-mongoloid admixture.

Japanese have 36% Jomon Y-DNA on average and 14% Jomon mtDNA on average.

Facial reconstruction of Jomon





An recontruction of Jomon and Yayoi





" Ainu, Jomon, Native American, Asians are genetically mongoloid, their hair, dental, fingerprints are also that of mongoloid. Anthropologist seems to think that Jomon are similar to ameridians with the acception of the Eskimo, Inuits and some southern aboriginal Indians, the only difference is that Jomon have light skin and hairy bodies which are superficial traits that can be adapted to the environment. An genetic study also indicate that Ainu (descendants of Jomon) and Native Americans are more related than to anyone.

Genetic link between Asians and native Americans: evidence from HLA genes and haplotypes.

We have been studying polymorphisms of HLA class I and II genes in East Asians including Buryat in Siberia, Mongolian, Han Chinese, Man Chinese, Korean Chinese, South Korean, and Taiwan indigenous populations in collaboration with many Asian scientists. Regional populations in Japan, Hondo-Japanese, Ryukyuan, and Ainu, were also studied. HLA-A, -B, and -DRB1 gene frequencies were subjected to the correspondence analysis and calculation of DA distances. The correspondence analysis demonstrated several major clusters of human populations in the world. "Mongoloid" populations were highly diversified, in which several clusters such as Northeast Asians, Southeast Asians, Oceanians, and Native Americans were observed. Interestingly, an indigenous population in North Japan, Ainu, was placed relatively close to Native Americans in the correspondence analysis. Distribution of particular HLA-A, -B, -DRB1 alleles and haplotypes was also analyzed in relation to migration and dispersal routes of ancestral populations. A number of alleles and haplotypes showed characteristic patterns of regional distribution. For example, B39-HR5-DQ7 (B*3901-DRB1*1406-DQB1*0301) was shared by Ainu and Native Americans. A24-Cw8-B48 was commonly observed in Taiwan indigenous populations, Maori in New Zealand, Orochon in Northeast China, Inuit, and Tlingit. These findings further support the genetic link between East Asians and Native Americans. We have proposed that various ancestral populations in East Asia, marked by different HLA haplotypes, had migrated and dispersed through multiple routes. Moreover, relatively small genetic distances and the sharing of several HLA haplotypes between Ainu and Native Americans suggest that these populations are descendants of some Upper Paleolithic populations of East Asia.

(This facial recontruction is what an 100% proto-Jomon looked like)

Jomon and Yayoi


Native Americans

Mandschure said:

One interesting relationship between Japan and Andaman Negritos is Y-DNA haplogroup D.

Haplogroup D makes up 100% of the Y-DNA genotype of Andaman Islanders, whereas it makes up 40% to 50% of Japanese, and approximately 70% to 80% of Ryukyuans and Ainu.

Some phenotype similarities between Japanese and Andaman Negritos are:

• Short stature
• Darker skin pigmentation
• More archaic features

A South Asian looking Japanese man, Shimoji Isamu:

Y-DNA haplogroup D is a descendant of DE. DE gave rise to both D and E. Y-DNA Haplogroup D is mainly found among Southeast Asia and Japan including the Andaman Islanders, Thais, Sumatra Indonesians, Tibeto-Burmans and Japanese.

Y-DNA haplogroup E, a brother of Y-DNA haplogroup D is most commonly found among Sub-Saharan Africans.

The origin of Y-DNA haplogroup D is in South Asia (near India or the Andaman Islands) which then spread to present day Burma and the Tibeto-Burman speaking areas, Thailand, Sumatra and eventually spread via a coastal route to Japan via Malaysia. Malaysia was later invaded by neolithic Southeast Asians, however Malays are generally a mix between Southeast Asians and South Asians. According to autosomal genetic studies, the Japanese are close to Malays and Malaysian Chinese in some genetic components.

A map showing populations with Negritoid affiliations:

In contrast, other East Asians have mainly Y-DNA haplogroup O which is the true East Asian lineage. Han Chinese and Koreans have approximately 80% to 90% O. A close relative of O, Y-DNA haplogroup N, is found in northern Eurasia and Baltic peoples (Finns, Estonians, Latvians, Belorussians, some Swedes).

Click to expand...

I SEE MANY MISTAKES.

Haplogroup D* is found only in the Adamanese islands.

Haplogroup D2, D1, D3 is found in other parts of Asia, they don't have anything to do with Adamanese. It's basically no different to Australians C5 and Mongolians C3, they are genetically divege and evolved markers from 60,000 years ago, there completely different in other words.

Ainu are related with Ameridians, no caucasoid, negrito, australoids
PURE BLOODED AINU ARE LIGHTER SKINNED THAN JAPANESE.
Ainu and Jomon are north Asian mongoloid group, as are Japanese




1) According to Cavalli-Sforza, Ainu are in the same genetic cluster as the "Northeast and East Asian"

Source: Cavalli-Sforza, L.L., Menozzi, P. & Piazza, A. (1994). The History and Geography of Human Genes. New Jersey: Princeton University Press.

2) Mark J. Hudson Professor of Anthropology at Nishikyushu University, Kanzaki, Saga, Japan, said Japan was settled by a "Proto-Mongoloid" population in the Pleistocene who became the Jōmon and their features can be seen in the Ainu and Okinawan people

Source: Hudson, Mark J. (1999). Ruins of identity: ethnogenesis in the Japanese Islands

3) Anthropologist Arnold Henry Savage Landor described the Ainu as having deep-set eyes and an eye shape typical of Europeans, with a large and prominent browridge, large ears, hairy and prone to baldness, slightly flattened hook nose with large and broad nostrils, prominent cheek bones, large mouth and thick lips and a long region from nose to mouth and small chin region

4) Omoto has also shown that the Ainu are Mongoloid, and not Caucasoid, on the basis of fingerprints and dental morphology

Source: The History and Geography of Human Genes By Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza, Paolo Menozzi, Alberto Piazza[

5) In the book of "Ainu life and legends" by author Kyōsuke Kindaichi (published by the Japanese Tourist Board in 1942) contains the physical description of Ainu : Many have wavy hair, but some straight black hair. Very few of them have wavy brownish hair. Their skins are generally reported to be light brown. But this is due to the fact that they labor on the sea and in briny winds all day. Old people who have long desisted from their outdoor work are often found to be as white as western men. The Ainu have broad faces, beetling eyebrows, and large sunken eyes, which are generally horizontal and of the so-called European type. Eyes of the Mongolian type are hardly found among them.



There is only one study which showed Japanese noise admixture of South Asians. Other studies show them to be completely 0%.




Those minor South Asian admixture have nothing to do with Ainu. The ainu are genetically speaking 100% mongoloid, if there is little South Asian admixture in Japanese it's because Cambodians, Vietnamese, Thais who may have constituted one of the migration to Japan. Even Russians have 12.5% Mongoloid DNA and even even the western Europeans have little bit of Siberian DNA.

Even the Indo-European of Central India have 9% Mongoloid DNA, but it's not because of Mongoloid people but because the austro-Asiatic people of India have 19-27% Mongoloid DNA in the Autosomal DNA



Southeast Asians have small frequencies South Asian mtDNA 3.8% and South Asian Y-DNA 5%

South Asian mtDNA

Mandschure said:

Fig. 1. Principal coordinate analysis of 31 world populations computed from Smith's MMD, based on 13 crown traits. AA, Australian Aborigine; A/P, Afghanistan/Pakistan; B, Bengal; EE (bs), Early Eurasia (Black Sea); EE, Early Egypt; ENE, Early North Europe; ELB, Early Lake Baikal; EJ (Jo), Early Japan (Jomon); ESEA, Early South East Asia; ET, Early Taiwan; IHG, Indian hunting/gathering; J, Japan; M, Myanmar; Me, Melanesia; Mi, Micronesia; N, Nepal; NA (AA), North Africa (Afro-Asiatic); NA (In), North American (Indian); NA (I), North American (Inuit); NC (M), North China (Mongolia); NE, North Europe; NME, Near Middle East; P, Polynesia; SA (B), South Africa (Bantu); SA (In), South American (Indian); SC, South China; SI, South India; SLHG, Sri Lankan hunting/gathering; SLS, Sri Lankan Sinhalese; SLT, Sri Lankan Tamil; T, Thailand.

You can see Early Japan (Jomon) is closest to Australian Aboriginies (AA). Furthermore, on PC1, Early Japan (Jomon) is completely within the Pacific cluster, and completely within the Australoid (including Sri Lankan) cluster in PC2.

Click to expand...

Your genetic chart clear shows mistake. It shows that NE, North Europe; North European are very close to SLT, Sri Lankan Tamils. It than shows Burmese are very close to early Egyptians and North African people. Even Australian aborigines and Jomon have an large compared to the others.

All I see is you posting those same charts many times before. Anyway mongolian have Haplogroup C3 but that doesn't mean it's related with Australian aborigines C5

Haplogroup D1 = Tibetan, Tibeto-Burmese
Haplogroup D2 = Jomon, Ainu, Japanese, Okinawans
Haplogroup D3 = Tibeto-Burmese, Tibetan, Thais, Javanese, Southwest china
Paragroup D* = Adamanese

Haplogroup C3 = Mongolians, Buryats, Kazakhs,
Haplogroup C4 = Australian aborigines
Haplogroup C5 = Found in Indian tribals

"
Within this lineage, ale Onges and Jarawas almost exclusively belong to Haplotype D, which is also found in Tibet and Japan, but is rare on the Indian mainland and elsewhere in Asia.[13] However, this is a subclade of the D haplogroup which has not been seen outside of the Andamans, a fact that underscores the insularity of these tribes.[14] The only other group that is known to predominantly belong to haplogroup D are the Ainu aboriginal people of Japan. "

SOURCE: Kumarasamy Thangaraj, Lalji Singh, Alla G. Reddy, V. Raghavendra Rao, Subhash C. Sehgal, Peter A. Underhill, Melanie Pierson, Ian G. Frame, and Erika Hagelberg (2002) (PDF), Genetic Affinities of the Andaman Islanders, a Vanishing Human Population
http://web.archive.org/web/20081029071336/http://hpgl.stanford.edu/publications/CB_2002_p1-18.pdf

Kennewick man is an 9500 years old Jomon





Maybe you didn't read my previous posts? it's here.

" Haplogroup D* and others markers genetically evolved and mutated 60,000 years from Ainu Haplogroup D2, Tibetan D1, Tibeto-Butmese D3 markers, there basically not even the same thing. So an Ainu with Haplogroup D2 or an Tibetan with D1 are as distinct from Negrito D* as Koreans O2b are distinct from Europeans R1a. "

Haplogroup D* Adamanese
Haplogroup D1 Tibetan
Haplogroup D2 Ainu, Jomon
Haplogroup D3 Tibeto-burmese

"
Within this lineage, ale Onges and Jarawas almost exclusively belong to Haplotype D, which is also found in Tibet and Japan, but is rare on the Indian mainland and elsewhere in Asia.[13] However, this is a subclade of the D haplogroup which has not been seen outside of the Andamans, a fact that underscores the insularity of these tribes.[14] The only other group that is known to predominantly belong to haplogroup D are the Ainu aboriginal people of Japan.[15] "

Andamanese people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Source" Tajima, Atsushi; et al. (2004), "Genetic origins of the Ainu inferred from combined DNA analyses of maternal and paternal lineages", Journal of Human Genetics 49 (4): 187–193,


Facial reconstruction of Jomon

An recontruction of Jomon and Yayoi

" Ainu, Jomon, Native American, Asians are genetically mongoloid, their hair, dental, fingerprints are also that of mongoloid. Anthropologist seems to think that Jomon are similar to ameridians with the acception of the Eskimo, Inuits and some southern aboriginal Indians, the only difference is that Jomon have light skin and hairy bodies which are superficial traits that can be adapted to the environment. An genetic study also indicate that Ainu (descendants of Jomon) and Native Americans are more related than to anyone.

Genetic link between Asians and native Americans: evidence from HLA genes and haplotypes.

We have been studying polymorphisms of HLA class I and II genes in East Asians including Buryat in Siberia, Mongolian, Han Chinese, Man Chinese, Korean Chinese, South Korean, and Taiwan indigenous populations in collaboration with many Asian scientists. Regional populations in Japan, Hondo-Japanese, Ryukyuan, and Ainu, were also studied. HLA-A, -B, and -DRB1 gene frequencies were subjected to the correspondence analysis and calculation of DA distances. The correspondence analysis demonstrated several major clusters of human populations in the world. "Mongoloid" populations were highly diversified, in which several clusters such as Northeast Asians, Southeast Asians, Oceanians, and Native Americans were observed. Interestingly, an indigenous population in North Japan, Ainu, was placed relatively close to Native Americans in the correspondence analysis. Distribution of particular HLA-A, -B, -DRB1 alleles and haplotypes was also analyzed in relation to migration and dispersal routes of ancestral populations. A number of alleles and haplotypes showed characteristic patterns of regional distribution. For example, B39-HR5-DQ7 (B*3901-DRB1*1406-DQB1*0301) was shared by Ainu and Native Americans. A24-Cw8-B48 was commonly observed in Taiwan indigenous populations, Maori in New Zealand, Orochon in Northeast China, Inuit, and Tlingit. These findings further support the genetic link between East Asians and Native Americans. We have proposed that various ancestral populations in East Asia, marked by different HLA haplotypes, had migrated and dispersed through multiple routes. Moreover, relatively small genetic distances and the sharing of several HLA haplotypes between Ainu and Native Americans suggest that these populations are descendants of some Upper Paleolithic populations of East Asia.

Click to expand...

KingButler said:

I SEE MANY MISTAKES.

Haplogroup D* is found only in the Adamanese islands.

Haplogroup D2, D1, D3 is found in other parts of Asia, they don't have anything to do with Adamanese. It's basically no different to Australians C5 and Mongolians C3, they are genetically divege and evolved markers from 60,000 years ago, there completely different in other words.

Ainu are related with Ameridians, no caucasoid, negrito, australoids
PURE BLOODED AINU ARE LIGHTER SKINNED THAN JAPANESE.
Ainu and Jomon are north Asian mongoloid group, as are Japanese

1) According to Cavalli-Sforza, Ainu are in the same genetic cluster as the "Northeast and East Asian"

Source: Cavalli-Sforza, L.L., Menozzi, P. & Piazza, A. (1994). The History and Geography of Human Genes. New Jersey: Princeton University Press.

2) Mark J. Hudson Professor of Anthropology at Nishikyushu University, Kanzaki, Saga, Japan, said Japan was settled by a "Proto-Mongoloid" population in the Pleistocene who became the Jōmon and their features can be seen in the Ainu and Okinawan people

Source: Hudson, Mark J. (1999). Ruins of identity: ethnogenesis in the Japanese Islands

3) Anthropologist Arnold Henry Savage Landor described the Ainu as having deep-set eyes and an eye shape typical of Europeans, with a large and prominent browridge, large ears, hairy and prone to baldness, slightly flattened hook nose with large and broad nostrils, prominent cheek bones, large mouth and thick lips and a long region from nose to mouth and small chin region

4) Omoto has also shown that the Ainu are Mongoloid, and not Caucasoid, on the basis of fingerprints and dental morphology

Source: The History and Geography of Human Genes By Luigi Luca Cavalli-Sforza, Paolo Menozzi, Alberto Piazza[

5) In the book of "Ainu life and legends" by author Kyōsuke Kindaichi (published by the Japanese Tourist Board in 1942) contains the physical description of Ainu : Many have wavy hair, but some straight black hair. Very few of them have wavy brownish hair. Their skins are generally reported to be light brown. But this is due to the fact that they labor on the sea and in briny winds all day. Old people who have long desisted from their outdoor work are often found to be as white as western men. The Ainu have broad faces, beetling eyebrows, and large sunken eyes, which are generally horizontal and of the so-called European type. Eyes of the Mongolian type are hardly found among them.

Click to expand...

Mandschure said:

The Japanese also have a Austro-Japanese language family classification according to some western linguists.

There are Mongolians in this PCA.

What we can tell from this PCA is that there is quite a close relationship between Japanese and Dravidian Indians.

Yayoi depictions of the aboriginal Jomon in Japan:

According to the diagrams, they look like Austro-Melanesians more than anything else.

The extent of migrations from Sundaland (present-day Malaysia). You can see that Japan received significant migrations from Malaysia, including southern China.

Click to expand...

Other than the fluffy/wavy hair I don't see anything Austro-melanesian about them. That skin tone an face look like middle easterners if you ask me.

You can also find them with white skin in portraits.



I've asked an Japanese, that blue graph you showed has to do more with culture migration than with human migration.

Y-DNA migration, ask you can see migration didn't just went right to Japan but had migrated to Siberia where markers evolved there.



And evidence that Ainu evolved Siberia and East Asia, all the predominate markers of Ainu mtDNA are found in north Asia.

Mandschure said:

Fig. 1. Principal coordinate analysis of 31 world populations computed from Smith's MMD, based on 13 crown traits. AA, Australian Aborigine; A/P, Afghanistan/Pakistan; B, Bengal; EE (bs), Early Eurasia (Black Sea); EE, Early Egypt; ENE, Early North Europe; ELB, Early Lake Baikal; EJ (Jo), Early Japan (Jomon); ESEA, Early South East Asia; ET, Early Taiwan; IHG, Indian hunting/gathering; J, Japan; M, Myanmar; Me, Melanesia; Mi, Micronesia; N, Nepal; NA (AA), North Africa (Afro-Asiatic); NA (In), North American (Indian); NA (I), North American (Inuit); NC (M), North China (Mongolia); NE, North Europe; NME, Near Middle East; P, Polynesia; SA (B), South Africa (Bantu); SA (In), South American (Indian); SC, South China; SI, South India; SLHG, Sri Lankan hunting/gathering; SLS, Sri Lankan Sinhalese; SLT, Sri Lankan Tamil; T, Thailand.

You can see Early Japan (Jomon) is closest to Australian Aboriginies (AA). Furthermore, on PC1, Early Japan (Jomon) is completely within the Pacific cluster, and completely within the Australoid (including Sri Lankan) cluster in PC2.

Click to expand...

I'll have to point this out again this genetic charts mistakes again.

It shows:

NE, North Europe; very close to SLT, Sri Lankan Tamils.

M, Myanmar very close EE, Early Egyptians and NN North African people.

ET, Early Taiwan very close J, Japan, SC South China.

While AA, Australian Aborigines and EJ, Jomon have an large gap.

Mandschure said:

YAP originated in South Asia, not Central Asia. Your Japanese source is incorrect.

Furthermore, Y-DNA haplogroup D is indeed a part of DE-YAP which are the most common Y chromosomes in Africa.

There are 2 main Y-DNA haplogroups which fall under DE-YAP:

• Y-DNA haplogroup D
• Y-DNA haplogroup E

Y-DNA haplogroup E is most common among Sub-Saharan Africans. Thus this connects Japanese to Africans too.

Y-DNA haplogroup E is most common among these populations:

• Sub-Saharan Africans (60% to 100%)

Y-DNA haplogroup D is most common among these populations:

• Andaman Negritos (90% to 100%)
• Japanese (20% to 48%)
• Okinawans (40% to 80%)
• Ainu (75% to 100%)
• Himalayans (30% to 70%)
• Indonesians (10% of Javanese)
• Thais (10%)

Also, Y-DNA haplogroup D has a southern Asian origin.

Click to expand...

But in the end none of haplogroup D are Negrito origin apart from their Paragroup D* which is found and isolated only in the Adamans, they have their own version of D* DNA. I don't understand why you still carry on with these different D types DNA in these Asian countries, you talk as if they are all Negrito lineages when they are absolutely not. It's like saying Mongolians have 50% C3 is because Australian aborigines C5. North Africans and South Europeans have 50% Eb1b1 is because West African and South African have 50% Ea1a1.

I must remind you Haplogroup Eb1b1 is not an Sub-Saharan African marker. It's found highest in South Europe, North Africa, and the East African population who are hybrids of Caucasoids and African. But it is almost non-existant in the Sub-Saharan Bantu and African speakers.


"
The Andamanese belong to the broad Y-chromosome lineage designated as M130 (haplogroup C) by Spencer Wells[1], who leads the Genographic Project. This is the lineage that seems to have emigrated from East Africa at least 50,000 years ago along the south coast of Asia eastwards to Australia. Within this lineage, the Andamanese (Onges and Jarawas) belong almost exclusively to the subtype designated Haplotype D, which is also common in Tibet and Japan, but rare on the Indian mainland.[13] However, this is a subclade of the D haplogroup which has not been seen outside of the Andamans, marking the insularity of these tribes.[14] The only other group that is known to predominantly belong to haplogroup D are the Ainu aboriginal people of Japan.[15] Male Great Andamanese, on the other hand, have a mixed presence of Y-chromosome haplogroups O, L, K and P, which places them between mainland Indian and Asian populations.[14] "



Distribution


D* paragroup is found with high frequency among Andaman Islanders and 0%-65% in Northeast India in adivasi tribes.[4][5][6][7] D-M174(xD1-M15, D2-P37, D3a-P47) has been found in approximately 5% of Altayans.[8] Kharkov et al. have found haplogroup D-M174(xD1-M15) in 6.3% (6/96) of a pool of samples of Southern Altaians from three different localities, particularly in Kulada (5/46 = 10.9%) and Kosh-Agach (1/7 = 14%), though they have not tested for any marker of the subclade D2 or D3. Kharkov et al. also have reported finding haplogroup DE-M1(xD-M174) Y-DNA in one Southern Altaian individual from Beshpeltir (1/43 = 2.3%).[9]

D1 (M15)
Found frequently among Tibeto-Burman populations of Southwestern China (including approximately 23% of Qiang,[2][10] approximately 12.5% of Tibetans,[2] and approximately 9% of Yi[2][11]) and Hmong–Mien speakers in Guangxi-Guizhou boundary regions[12][dead link] with a moderate distribution throughout Central Asia, East Asia, and Southeast Asia (Vietnam).[2]


D2 (M55)
Found with high frequency among Ainu, Japanese, and Ryukyuans.


D3a (P47)
Found with high frequency among Pumi,[2] Naxi,[2] and Tibetans,[2] with a moderate distribution in Central Asia.[2]

Mandschure said:

Also, Y-DNA haplogroup D has a southern Asian origin.

YAP insertion signature in South Asia.

Chandrasekar A et al.

A total of 2169 samples from 21 tribal populations from different regions of India were scanned for the Y-chromosome Alu polymorphism. This study reports, for the first time, high frequencies (8-65%) of Y Alu polymorphic (YAP) insertion in northeast Indian tribes. All seven Jarawa samples from the Andaman and Nicobar islands had the YAP insertion, in conformity with an earlier study of Andaman Islanders. One isolated case with haplotype E* was found in Dungri Bhill, a western Indian population, while YAP insertion in northeast India and Andaman tribes was found in association with haplotype D* (M168, M174). YAP insertion frequencies reported in the mainland Indian populations are negligible, according to previous studies. Genetic drift may be the causative factor for the variable frequency of the YAP insertion in the mainland populations, while the founder effect may have resulted in the highest incidence of haplotype D among the Andaman Islanders. The results of YAP insertion and the evidence of previous mtDNA studies indicate an early out of Africa migration to the Andaman and Nicobar Islands. The findings of YAP insertion in northeast Indian tribes are very significant for understanding the evolutionary history of the region.

Y-DNA haplogroup DE-YAP originated in Africa

Y-DNA haplogroup D is most common among Andaman Negritos and Japanese

Y-DNA haplogroup D originated in the Andaman Islands:

The Andaman M4 haplotype has been found previously in mainland India (Kivisild et al. 1999b), whereas the two Andaman M2 haplotypes are (so far) unique to the Andamanese. Given that (1) the latter two types occupy a basal position in the M2 network, which has an estimated coalescence time of 63,000±6,000 years (Kivisild et al. 1999b), and (2) they are not found in mainland India, Endicott et al. (2003) conclude they represent an “early” settlement of the Andaman Islands. These two points need discussion

Regarding point 1, the age of a haplogroup cannot be automatically equated to the age of subsets of this haplogroup. The founding type of haplogroup M2, characterized by 16223T and 16319A relative to the Cambridge reference sequence (CRS) (Anderson et al. 1981) (fig. 1), is dated to 63,000 years but is still present in mainland India. This does not mean that any cluster branching off of this node is 63,000 years old, but rather that it is, at most, 63,000 years old. In principle, the Andaman M2 cluster could be dated to any time between 63,000 years and today.

So the date of when the Andamanese (proto-Australoids) first inhabited the Andaman Islands is actually 60,000 to 70,000 years ago.

Since the studies have found that the Andamanese Negritos inhabited the Andaman Islands 60,000 to 70,000 years ago and that the oldest form of haplogroup D is found in them this suggests a southern origin of haplogroup D.

Shi Hong et al. 2008

Hence, the alternative explanation of northern origin of D-M174 is unlikely considering the absence of YAP+ in North Asia [29] and the sporadic appearance of D-M174 in Central Asia [23]. Consequently, the southern origin of D-M174 can be established, which is consistent with the proposed initial settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia and the migration pattern of other Y chromosome lineages [8,9,13].

When plenty southern populations were studied, we observed a higher diversity in those populations compared with the northern populations [8,9].

Also haplgroup D can be described as being part of the great coastal migration because it spread from Africa, through southern Arabia and into Southeast Asia (including the Andaman Islands) before spreading to the Himalayas and Japan. All peer-reviewed scientific sources from 2006 onwards support this.

Click to expand...

The only problem is the misinterpretations of facts you presented. The point is not that Haplogroup D originated from the Adamanese, the point is you want to claim that all D markers were Negrito especially Ainu. Judging from your logic Mongolians are also mixed with Australoid, Actually all of East Asian and Southeast Asia are mixed with Australoid even Koreans because mtDNA N and M which are descendants from African mtDNA L makes up for 25% of Chinese, Mongolian, Tibetan, Japanese, Koreans, Southeast Asian lineages.

Haplogroup D1, D2, D3 are not Negrito markers, Adamanese have their own version of Haplogroup D* which is found and isolated only in the Adamans islands.

Haplogroup D-M174 = Haplogroup D Adamanese ( Paragroup D*)

Haplogroup D-M15 = Haplogroup D1 Tibetan, Tibeto-Burmese, Han Chinese

Haplogroup D-M55 = Haplogroup D2 Jomon, Ainu, Japanese, Ryukuan

Haplogroup D-P47 = Haplogroup D3a Tibeto-burmese, Tajiks, Tibetan, Turkic.

Coastal migration theory in Asia and Oceania

The coastal route is primarily used to describe the initial peopling of the Arabian peninsula, India, Southeast Asia, New Guinea, Australia, coastal China and Japan,[8][9] and is linked with the presence and dispersal of mtDNA haplogroup M and haplogroup N, as well as the specific distribution patterns of Y-DNA haplogroup C and haplogroup D, in these regions.[4][6] The theory proposes that humans, likely similar to the Negritos or Proto-Australoids of modern times, arrived in the Arabian peninsula from Africa, then on the southern coastal regions of the Indian mainland, followed by spread to the Andaman Islands and modern-day Indonesia, and thence branching southwards to Australia and northwards towards Japan.[9] National Geographic's Genographic Project uses the term 'Coastal Clan' to describe the initial human groups of Y-DNA haplogroup C who expanded eastwards out from Africa along the coastal route around 50 kybp.[10]

Click to expand...

So for your information is NOT only Y-DNA D, but Y-DNA C and mtDNA M, N migrated from Africa to East Asia. So if you want to claim D is Australoid you have to claim C, mtDNA M, N aswell. PLEASE... understand that race mutate, both genetically and anthropologically. As soon as Haplogroup D migrated to Japan, the people started genetically and racially mutated. Even Australian aborigines are ancestors of Caucasoid race. You can 't just make claims that Haplogroup D2 is Negrito just because Adamanese carried Haplogroup D. Yayoi migrants came to Japan only 300 BC, but all Jomon people dating back 14,000 B.C were found to be more similar to Caucasians in appearance, actually it's actually more similar to Caucasoid.

" The Jōmon share many physical characteristics with Caucasians, but Brace says that they are a separate genetic stock "

Source:How New Science Is Tracing America's Ice Age Mariners. New York: Atria Books. Madsen, DB, ed

Jomon skulls dating back 14,000 BC to 30,000 B.C till this day the Ainu still resemble them most.








Even East Asians evolved from Proto-Mongoloid like the Jomon, but all of them they can trace their ancestors from Australoids.

Lahr said the other hypothesis is that Mongoloids originate from "Southeast Asian populations" that "expanded from "Africa to Southeast Asia" during the "first half of the Upper Pleistocene" and then traveled to "Australia-Melanesia" and "East Asia".[21] Lahr said the "morphology" of the "Paleoindian" is consistent with the "proto-Mongoloid definition".

Mandschure said:

Read it:

Y-DNA haplogroup D originated in the Andaman Islands:

The Andaman M4 haplotype has been found previously in mainland India (Kivisild et al. 1999b), whereas the two Andaman M2 haplotypes are (so far) unique to the Andamanese. Given that (1) the latter two types occupy a basal position in the M2 network, which has an estimated coalescence time of 63,000±6,000 years (Kivisild et al. 1999b), and (2) they are not found in mainland India, Endicott et al. (2003) conclude they represent an “early” settlement of the Andaman Islands. These two points need discussion.

Regarding point 1, the age of a haplogroup cannot be automatically equated to the age of subsets of this haplogroup. The founding type of haplogroup M2, characterized by 16223T and 16319A relative to the Cambridge reference sequence (CRS) (Anderson et al. 1981) (fig. 1), is dated to 63,000 years but is still present in mainland India. This does not mean that any cluster branching off of this node is 63,000 years old, but rather that it is, at most, 63,000 years old. In principle, the Andaman M2 cluster could be dated to any time between 63,000 years and today.

So the date of when the Andamanese (proto-Australoids) first inhabited the Andaman Islands is actually 60,000 to 70,000 years ago.

Since the studies have found that the Andamanese Negritos inhabited the Andaman Islands 60,000 to 70,000 years ago and that the oldest form of haplogroup D is found in them this suggests a southern origin of haplogroup D.

Shi Hong et al. 2008

Hence, the alternative explanation of northern origin of D-M174 is unlikely considering the absence of YAP+ in North Asia [29] and the sporadic appearance of D-M174 in Central Asia [23]. Consequently, the southern origin of D-M174 can be established, which is consistent with the proposed initial settlement of modern humans in mainland Southeast Asia and the migration pattern of other Y chromosome lineages [8,9,13].

When plenty southern populations were studied, we observed a higher diversity in those populations compared with the northern populations [8,9].

Also haplgroup D can be described as being part of the great coastal migration because it spread from Africa, through southern Arabia and into Southeast Asia (including the Andaman Islands) before spreading to the Himalayas and Japan. All peer-reviewed scientific sources from 2006 onwards support this.

Y-DNA haplogroup D (M174) originated near the Andaman Islands before expanding towards Japan and the Himalayas.

Therefore the Japanese who have Y-DNA haplogroup D are direct descendants of the same ancestors who gave birth to the Andaman Islanders.

M174 (D) is the father branch, whereas D2, D2, D3 are all subclades of M174 (D).

Click to expand...

I've read that long time ago already, I have no problem understanding them. It's telling you how Haplogroup D from Adamans island migrated to Asia. Haplogroup D was not only the markers that migrated the from Southern route, the Haplogroup C also had southern origin, mtDNA M an N also had southern origin. Adamanese have 100% mtDNA M and 100% D.

If you know that D1, D2, D3 are all subclades than you will also understand that all of these subclades are different mutated markers. And of course the people who carry these subclades markers will also look different from eachother aswell.

Btw southern population does not always mean Negrito. In other context they can say Haplogroup O1 also have an southern origin but that has nothing to do with Negrito.

Mandschure said:

Why do you think Japanese have ASI or South Asian admixture when most Han Chinese and all Koreans don't? It's because Japanese are mixed with Jomon Japanese who are related to ASI (Andaman Islanders) and Veddoids.

Click to expand...

And why do you think Southeast Asians have more South Asian DNA than Japanese? There is also records that Southeast Asians have migrated to Japan.

If Jomons are South Asians like you claim than wouldn't that completely contradict the autosomal DNA of yours that claimed Japanese Jomon components were 23.1% - 46%, although such study was criticized by Dienekes as overestimating Jomon components, other studies Shows Japanese are only 20% Jomon which seems the most likely.

Here's the questions, if Jomon are South Asians and Japanese have 20% Jomon blood that would make them 20% South Asian why than your chart only shows an noisy 2-3% South Asian admixture?

Since Ainu are predominately Jomon, why than are they in the East Asian cluster? "According to Cavalli-Sforza, Ainu are in the same genetic cluster as the "Northeast and East Asian"

This chart shows Japanese have 0% South Asian admixture.



South Asian mtDNA is found 3.8% in Vietnamese, I don't know their Y-DNA.

South Asian mtDNA in Cambodian is 4.7% however they also have 7-12% South Asian Y-DNA so of course they are going to have the highest South Asian admixture. I think it kind goes well with your Autosomal DNA chart, since is telling us that Cambodian South Asian autosomal DNA ranges from 15-20%. The truth is South Asian DNA may even be higher in Cambodians, this green colored mtDNA chart tell us only about the South Indian mtDNA but not North Indian mtDNA who are both South Asian. So the actual South Asian mtDNA and mixture may even be much higher in Cambodians.

Burmese have 7-15% South Asian mtDNA, but have little South Asian Y-DNA so this is why there not as South Asian as Cambodians. Ussually southern Burmese have more noticeable South Asian admixture

Now how is it possible that Japanese with 14% Jomon mtDNA with 36% Jomon Y-DNA on average have sooo very little South Asian DNA?