Roman Elite Military Units

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

Hi guys, wanted to have a discussion on Roman elite military units. For example, in my country we have the special operations forces (Rangers, SF, SEALs, SMU's). Now, I'm not referring specifically to special operations - it just so happens that special operations happen to be the elite military class of today. In 480 BC, the elite military class was the spartan phalanx for example.

In Ancient Rome, who were the elite? I've heard Roman Cavalry and Praetorians thrown out a lot, but were they truly considered the elite military class? And how would one join either (or any un named organization) and what did their training and selection process look like?

Go!

AlpinLuke · Aug 1, 2013

Just some thoughts.

Let's start from the core of Roman military organization:

the Legion.

Best military single units were embedded in legions, so that if we look for special forces "ante litteram" we had to take a look at them.

Legionaries were what Marines are now in the United States, they were an elite wide corp, extremely trained, organized and efficient.

But they weren't a special force [like SEALS].

Pretorians were not that "special", with them during the Flavi dynasty there was something at least particular [I cannot say "special"] the "corporis custodes" [more similar to US Secret Service].

In general, I would talk about specialized units in the Legion, more than "Special Forces". Actually legionaries were trained and ready for the "special operations" of their age.

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

AlpinLuke said:
Just some thoughts.

Let's start from the core of Roman military organization:

the Legion.

Best military single units were embedded in legions, so that if we look for special forces "ante litteram" we had to take a look at them.

Legionaries were what Marines are now in the United States, they were an elite wide corp, extremely trained, organized and efficient.

But they weren't a special force [like SEALS].

Pretorians were not that "special", with them during the Flavi dynasty there was something at least particular [I cannot say "special"] the "corporis custodes" [more similar to US Secret Service].

In general, I would talk about specialized units in the Legion, more than "Special Forces". Actually legionaries were trained and ready for the "special operations" of their age.

I think Dan Carlin describes it best, that being if the Roman legions were magically transported 1000 years later, they would utterly dominate almost any other army. So in short, they would all be considered elite. I wouldn't necessarily liken them to USMC, but Royal Marine Commandoes in that they were a better trained, more lethal force.

But with that said, who would be considered the elite of the elite?

Mangekyou · Aug 1, 2013

I don't like using the word "elite" as it can depend upon translation, but some notable units would be;

Frumentarii - Spies, espionage gatherers attached to legions.
Equites singulares Augusti [ESA] - Personal cavalry to the emperor.
Cohortes Urbanae - City police of Rome, but in emergencies could take to field.
Scholae Palatinae - Guard unit established by Constantine to replace ESA.
Protectores Domestici - Household bodyguards to the late Roman emperors
Palatini - Attached to escort armies during the late empire.

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

Mangekyou said:
I don't like using the word "elite" as it can depend upon translation, but some notable units would be;

Frumentarii - Spies, espionage gatherers attached to legions.
Equites singulares Augusti [ESA] - Personal cavalry to the emperor.
Cohortes Urbanae - City police of Rome, but in emergencies could take to field.
Scholae Palatinae - Guard unit established by Constantine to replace ESA.
Protectores Domestici - Household bodyguards to the late Roman emperors
Palatini - Attached to escort armies during the late empire.

Let me clarify, the Roman Military was elite as a whole, just specifying as to who would be considered the elite of the elite. Nothing necessarily wrong with that.

Good post, could you go into more detail regarding each unit?

M.E.T.H.O.D. · Aug 1, 2013

Romulus allegedly created an elite cavalry unit, the Celeres(the fast ones) to personally protect his person in both peace and war.
The corp of the Celeres was disbanded by Romulus' successor, Numa Pompilius

Micheal Weston · Aug 1, 2013

The 13th and 10th under ceasar preformed insane feats that can only be accomplished through experience, dedication, motivation, and ambition. Seriously though, the odds they fought, im shocked that they didn't rout

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

Micheal Weston said:
The 13th and 10th under ceasar preformed insane feats that can only be accomplished through experience, dedication, motivation, and ambition. Seriously though, the odds they fought, im shocked that they didn't rout

The 10th legion was probably one of the fighter fighting forces ever assembled, was the 13th really that good? Or is their apparent success due to the tv show?

Thaladan · Aug 1, 2013

The first century of the first cohort in each legion, commanded by the Primus Pilus (the most senior centurion), was - at least theoretically - formed of the best men in that legion. So, you could certainly describe that as an elite unit.

Kevinmeath · Aug 1, 2013

Thaladan said:
The first century of the first cohort in each legion, commanded by the Primus Pilus (the most senior centurion), was - at least theoretically - formed of the best men in that legion. So, you could certainly describe that as an elite unit.

I think they were also double strength.

Its often sais that only one man could tell the Primus Pilus (the hardest of the hardest) 'what to do', who would that be ?

Thaladan · Aug 1, 2013

Kevinmeath said:
I think they were also double strength.

Its often sais that only one man could tell the Primus Pilus (the hardest of the hardest) 'what to do', who would that be ?

I assume that would be the Legatus.

Yes, the first cohort would have five double-strength centuries of 160 men each, making 800 altogether. Of course, in reality the legions were always understrength, so it was never that much.

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

Ah, good post Thaladan. How would one eventually make it into the first cohort? Was there a selection process? Or were hand picked NCO's and Officers assigned to that unit? And were they there to serve as shock troops, to serve as a standard for the rest of the units, or as an auxiliary reserve (used in times of desperation)? Or did they fill all those roles?

Now, as far as Roman cavalry, were they truly considered an elite force? Or is that a fallacy? And speaking of cavalry, regarding the 10th legio equestris, I'm well familiar as to how they received their name but did they ever serve as cavalry at any one point in time?

Kevinmeath · Aug 1, 2013

Thaladan said:
I assume that would be the Legatus.

Yes, the first cohort would have five double-strength centuries of 160 men each, making 800 altogether. Of course, in reality the legions were always understrength, so it was never that much.

In theory yes but that's a bit like saying the most important man in a British army regiment is the Colonel, which is of course true -- to a degree because everyone perhaps even the Colonel knows its actually the RSM.

But in the Roman system there was even one man who 'ranked' above the Primus Pilus.

AlpinLuke · Aug 1, 2013

The Roman legions won thanks to heavy infantry more than thanks to chivalry [the example of how Romans defeated Britons under Boudicca is clear].

The first lines of the infantry were made by the best legionaries and they had to stand the impact of the enemy.

Among them there were groups of legionaries extremely trained to form a real "special unit" [not special force, since the conception of special force is quite modern, to be accurate]: the "Roman Testudo".

The Roman Testudo was comparable to the phalanx as for required training of the members to be effective on the battle field.

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

AlpinLuke said:
The Roman legions won thanks to heavy infantry more than thanks to chivalry [the example of how Romans defeated Britons under Boudicca is clear].

Chivalry? Explain....

AlpinLuke · Aug 1, 2013

Polynikes said:
Chivalry? Explain....

In Roman age riding warriors hadn't stirrups so that they weren't that able to take complete advantage from the kinetic energy of a charge. They usually got close to infantry hitting with bows. Using lances / spears they charged, but the impact of that charge wasn't that extreme [in comparison with medieval chivalry]. If infantry density was high, Roman chivalry usually avoided the direct charge [they just got quickly close hitting the sides of the infantry formation. Once that formation was open, they charged in deep].

On the other hand, heavy infantry conquered the battlefield. Boudicca lost because she launched her enormous army against the Roman heavy infantry. The Romans opposed resistance acquiring the short distance. The big shield, the body protections and the short swords gave a real advantage against the less organized, less protected [by armors] and with long swords, britons [long swords were even a limitation in that hand to hand fight].

AlpinLuke · Aug 1, 2013

P.S. a part of the role of the stirrups was played by saddles built just to make the rider more stable. But those saddles weren't as effective as stirrups.

Polynikes · Aug 1, 2013

Oh, cavalry, I thought you had meant chivalry.

Didn't the legions eventually adopt the stirrup? And they adapted to them very well?

And in regards to the Praetorians, how was their skill in combat?

Mangekyou · Aug 1, 2013

AlpinLuke said:
P.S. a part of the role of the stirrups was played by saddles built just to make the rider more stable. But those saddles weren't as effective as stirrups.

The role of the saddle not being as effective as the Stirrup was disproved by Peter Connolly.

Vergil · Aug 1, 2013

"Ancient Rome" is a pretty expansive era. During Republican times in an army like Julius Caesar's in Gaul he held his own 10th legion as a favorite, not 'elite' in the sense of training but certainly in the sense of espirit de corps. He certainly favored them and they repaid him with performance & loyalty. During the mid-late Principate under Trajan for example a legion seems to have performed the role of shock-troops to be used in conjunction with auxiliary units.

Per most military historians of that era generally the first cohort of every legion was considered the most prestigious.

And of course much of it depends on what snap-shot in time you're looking at.

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Roman Elite Military Units

Polynikes

AlpinLuke

Polynikes

Mangekyou

Polynikes

M.E.T.H.O.D.

Micheal Weston

Polynikes

Thaladan

Kevinmeath

Thaladan

Polynikes

Kevinmeath

AlpinLuke

Polynikes

AlpinLuke

AlpinLuke

Polynikes

Mangekyou

Vergil

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