Honestly, it would be possible to unite them into one country, to create a certain union, because there are really many common features and a historical past. But to say that France could be Germany or vice versa, I still would not
Can we consider France a Germanic country?
- Thread starter sherdogger
- Start date
Thinking about my message of yesterday, where I said:
"And in that thread I met already the difficulties between languages and the culture of the country were the language border passed through... "
I had better said: the difficulties of the "distinction" between languages and the culture of...
And yes "culture" has also such a wide range of concepts that it is difficult to use it in this context?
Better perhaps in this context the expression: "way of life"? "people's mentality"?
Paul.
"And in that thread I met already the difficulties between languages and the culture of the country were the language border passed through... "
I had better said: the difficulties of the "distinction" between languages and the culture of...
And yes "culture" has also such a wide range of concepts that it is difficult to use it in this context?
Better perhaps in this context the expression: "way of life"? "people's mentality"?
Paul.
If Vandals and Visigoths stayed home in Deutschland, they wouldn't be latinzied. They had wished to do business in the territory of the Roman empire, and got a vulgar Latin as their first language.
Joined Mar 2020
2,003 Posts | 1,837+
UK
France is no more "Germanic" and, indeed, a good deal less so than the USA or the UK. The English are a lot closer to to the Germans in terms of language and cultural heritage than the French. Indeed the very word "English" comes from "Anglish" - which refers to the Angle tribes that migrated to Britain from Schleswig-Holstein in around 500 AD.
French as a language evolved from a combination of Vulgar Latin and the language of the Gauls (part of the Gallo-Romance language group). This group of languages has its origins in France, Catalan speaking Spain and the Gallo-Italic languages of north western Italy (such as Piedemontese and the western and eastern Lombard languages).
The French are linguistically far closer to Spain and Italy than they are to Germany.
French as a language evolved from a combination of Vulgar Latin and the language of the Gauls (part of the Gallo-Romance language group). This group of languages has its origins in France, Catalan speaking Spain and the Gallo-Italic languages of north western Italy (such as Piedemontese and the western and eastern Lombard languages).
The French are linguistically far closer to Spain and Italy than they are to Germany.
Language does not mean everything.
Of course french culture has a lot to do with her roman heritage. But speaking a latin-rooted (with a lot of greek by the way) language does not mean that the people are 100% ethnically related to the latin world.
Lot of people in India speak english, it does not make Indian people "anglo-saxon".
People in northern and eastern France spoke germanic languages up to the begining of the 20th century. In south-west, they spoke Basque. In Brittany they spoke celtic (there are schools today in Brittany were the main language is celtic/briton).
So once again, France is not a peninsula or an island. It's a cross road between the germanic and the latin world, with a celtic/germanic people speaking a latin rooted language.
Of course french culture has a lot to do with her roman heritage. But speaking a latin-rooted (with a lot of greek by the way) language does not mean that the people are 100% ethnically related to the latin world.
Lot of people in India speak english, it does not make Indian people "anglo-saxon".
People in northern and eastern France spoke germanic languages up to the begining of the 20th century. In south-west, they spoke Basque. In Brittany they spoke celtic (there are schools today in Brittany were the main language is celtic/briton).
So once again, France is not a peninsula or an island. It's a cross road between the germanic and the latin world, with a celtic/germanic people speaking a latin rooted language.
From linguistic point of view France is called Frankreich in German. Frankreich literally means The Realm of the Franks or The Frankish Realm like in the good ole days of Merovingians and Carolingians. The Franks as we know was a west Germanic tribe. In return the French called Germany Alamannia after the ancient Germanic confederation situated in Swabia.
Joined May 2016
12,115 Posts | 4,890+
Portugal
For the last decades or even two centuries the classification of Latin or Germanic is much more related to language and not with ancestry (that furthermore could lead us to a territory not allowed by the forum rules). That is why we have the concepts of Latin America or Latin Africa. If we make classifications acording to acestry the things would be much more messy and not even the Italic Peninsula or the Iberian Peninsula would be Latin.
Tulius,
I wanted to answer something in the same vein to Elric, because in such discussions after a while, as you mention among others, the discussion is sidetracked to a much more messy discussion as what some French call: "les Français de souche"
(The French "de souche"" do they exist?)
As I understand it, the people living in France since some generations?
Even I, had to have been cautious in my use of words in my last message as "culture", "way of life", "people's mentality" as they can easely become interpreted by "some" as indeed the expression in Dutch and in German too of "volksaard" (national character) and in German "volksnatur" (people's mentality), which has a much more loaded content than in the English language, as it points to the mentality of those living in a country since generations (a bit as the French: "Français de souche")
Although that I guess that the original poster pointed to this French ancestry, let us stick to the Germanic and Romance language groups...
And there I have seen that people, time and time again, overestimate the value of the language in the context of the "national" identity.
A language is only the written or oral vehicle of the expression of thoughts from one individual to other ones. And as such a certain language can easely used instead of another one, while the thoughts of the individual in whatever language remain the same. If the translation is made correctly, for the receiver of the thoughts normally the interpretation of these thoughts has to be the same in whatever language they are expressed. And interpretation can differ of course even in one's "own" language?
I agree the "teneur" of some words in different languages can be differ in interpretation as I mentioned for instance the Dutch word "volksaard" and the German "Volksnatur" if translated in Engisch. But so can a word as "belief" or "constitution" even in English itself?
Kind regards, Paul.
Joined Jan 2011
1,127 Posts | 46+
FRANCE
It take me less then a minute to find out who is French and who is German.
One minute to see who is Flemish and who is Walloon.
My dear European Romance/Germanic language border friend, of course for me also less than a minute to find out who is Flemish or Walloon as they both speak dialects one of Dutch
and the other of French, but I see them both eating French fries with mayonaise at a friture/friterie...or are it Belgian fries?
Kind regards from your friend Paul.
Excuses to everyone.
I had yesterday better removed the big picture of the French fries immediately while it was still possible to edit the message. It disturbs as I see now afterwards the smootly going on of the thread and now seemingly it is not possible anymore
Paul.
I had yesterday better removed the big picture of the French fries immediately while it was still possible to edit the message. It disturbs as I see now afterwards the smootly going on of the thread and now seemingly it is not possible anymore
Paul.
Joined Oct 2013
24,148 Posts | 6,119+
Europix
potato came from the New World
as tomato
potato came from the New World
as tomato
This comes from the New World:
But this not:
Joined Aug 2013
4,921 Posts | 629+
Lorraine tudesque
Last edited:
The French Revolution was the end of the German France.
The French ruling class , since Clovis, was always considered to be German .
So the French Revolution was the final victory of the Gaulish against the invaders.
In the 19C under Napoléon III , Vercingétorix, become a national heroe.
The latest development of this Gaulish thing was the Gaulish Village with Astérix and Obélix.
The French ruling class , since Clovis, was always considered to be German .
So the French Revolution was the final victory of the Gaulish against the invaders.
In the 19C under Napoléon III , Vercingétorix, become a national heroe.
The latest development of this Gaulish thing was the Gaulish Village with Astérix and Obélix.
Joined May 2016
12,115 Posts | 4,890+
Portugal
potato came from the New World
as tomato
Yes, McDonald's came to Europe from the New World.
i do believe @deaf tuner is referring to the Belgian fries on the photo, because this is what they are. The mayonnaise is french and the ketchup is American... or Chinese.
More History Discussions
Trending History Discussions
-
The Great Captains of History - How Many Battles? - Version 7- Started by DiocletianIsBetterThanYou
- Replies: 861
-
-
The Great Captains of History - How Many Battles? - Version 5
- Started by DiocletianIsBetterThanYou
- Replies: 3K
-
The Diversity Of Early African Architecture/Ruins Thread- Started by Kilwa Sultanate
- Replies: 2K
-