Which European country was the most powerful in the era? 1000-1500

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Which European country was the most powerful in the era between 1000-1500 ?

My opinion is Medieval Hungary. Many Hungarian kings had larger inland-revenues and larger armies than their Western European colleagues. Very few country could fight in 3-4 front-line wars with victory in human history.


[ame]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_hungary[/ame]


The reason:

The differences between Hungary and feudal Europe:

"Medieval Hungarian constitutional development made the power of Hungarian Kings the most efficient one of medieval age, and that reason was the absence of feudalism. No doubt, infiltrations of feudalism, as prevalent through-out Europe, are to be found in old Hungarian institutions, but as an accidental inter-mixture only, not as their essence and chief feature. That blending of public prerogative with rights belonging to the sphere of private law, which is the essence of feudalism never prevailed in the organisation of Hungarian public powers, never broke their action on the nation as a whole. To this early prevalence of public law in the government of the country do Hungary owe not only a superior efficiency not detrimental to liberty of Hungarian public powers, but in connection with it an early growth of conscious national unity, of patriotism on broad lines, at a time when tribal feeling and feudal allegiance sub-divided all European nations into small units which paralysed each other, and into a corresponding fractional mentality adverse to the very idea of State and to inchoate national feeling." ( Count Albert Apponyi: "The juridical nature of the relations between Austria and Hungary" Arts and Science Congress, held at United States St. Louis in 1904 )


Countries under the control of Louis the Great of Hungary (larger than HRE in its biggest extension)

Louis_role.jpg



Western conquests of king Matthias Corvinus (wars against HRE) Remember early-absolutist france was stopped and defeated by Habsburgs, Matthias Corvinus conquered the capital city of Habsburgs :)))))

The_wars_of_Matthias_Corvinus_of_Hungary_(1458-1490).png
 
Joined Apr 2008
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Hyperborea
Hungary.

But not just 1000-1500 I would say in the world of all time................. Barely a day goes by I don't look up to heavens and be thankful to have been born unto an Earth where Hungary exists.
 

vid

Joined Jun 2009
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Slovakia
Not really my area of expertise, but I find it quite unlikely that there was a single country most powerful over entire half of a millenium.
 
Joined May 2009
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New Jersey
I would say from 1000s-1300s the most powerful was the Byzantines, 1400s was HRE, and 1500s was Spain.

In the 1300s-1400s Northern Italy had a high standard of living and wealth, but they didn't have the man power, so they can't be considered militarily powerful, but were strong in other categories.
 
Joined Feb 2011
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I would say from 1000s-1300s the most powerful was the Byzantines, 1400s was HRE, and 1500s was Spain.

There were 9 wars between HRE and Hungary , and the HRE lost 7 wars against Hungary. It is true for Byzantine Empire
 
Joined Feb 2011
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Hungary.

But not just 1000-1500 I would say in the world of all time................. Barely a day goes by I don't look up to heavens and be thankful to have been born unto an Earth where Hungary exists.

Did you see the maps? Or read the [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_hungary]History of Hungary - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]
 
Joined Apr 2008
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Hyperborea
I know little about Hungary's history, but I understand Subutai lead and army there once. Not sure what happened, perhaps you could tell me about this part of Hungarian history.
 
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I know little about Hungary's history, but I understadn Subutai lead and army there once. Not sure what happened, perhaps you could tell me about this part of Hungarian history.

In 1241–1242, the kingdom received a major blow with the Mongol Invasion: after the defeat of the Hungarian army at the Battle of Mohi,[23] Béla IV of Hungary fled, and a large part of the population died[24] in the ensuing destruction leading later to the invitation of settlers, largely from Germany. Historians estimate that up to half of Hungary's then population of 2,000,000 were victims of the Mongol invasion.[25] In the plains between 50 and 80% of the settlements were destroyed.[26] Only 80 castles, strongly fortified cities and abbeys could withstand the assault.

As a consequence, after the Mongols retreated, King Béla ordered the construction of hundreds of stone castles and fortifications, to defend against a possible second Mongol invasion. The Mongols returned to Hungary in 1286, but the new built stone-castle systems and new tactics (using a higher proportion of heavily armed knights) stopped them. The invading Mongol force was defeated near Pest by the royal army of Ladislaus IV of Hungary. As with later invasions, it was repelled handily, the Mongols losing much of their invading force.
These castles proved to be very important later in the long struggle with the Ottoman Empire. However the cost of building them indebted the Hungarian King to the major feudal landlords again, so the royal power reclaimed by Béla IV after his father Andrew II significantly weakened it was once again dispersed amongst lesser nobility. The countries of the Balkan region and the territory of Russian states fell under Ottoman/Mongolian rule very rapidly, due to the lack of the network of stone/brick castles and fortresses in these countries.
 
Joined Jul 2009
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Anatolia
I would say from 1000s-1300s the most powerful was the Byzantines, 1400s was HRE, and 1500s was Spain.

In the 1300s-1400s Northern Italy had a high standard of living and wealth, but they didn't have the man power, so they can't be considered militarily powerful, but were strong in other categories.

I would have objection. Byzantines became nothing more than a Balkan principality after they lost Anatolia where was main center of the productivity.
 
Joined Feb 2011
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I would have objection. Byzantines became nothing more than a Balkan principality after they lost Anatolia where was main center of the productivity.

And don't forget the era when Hungarian rulers taxated byzantine Empire and most of Europe: From Byzantine Empire to present-day Spain :))))



Hungarian raids (we collected taxes from their monarchs....) in the 10th century
Kalandozasok.jpg
 
Joined Jul 2009
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Anatolia
And don't forget the era when Hungarian rulers taxated byzantine Empire and most of Europe: From Byzantine Empire to present-day Spain :))))



Hungarian raids (we collected taxes from their monarchs....) in the 10th century

Hungarians were glorious and greath power in their days.

and

Cebimde elma var. :)
 
Joined Apr 2010
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Loch na Seilg, Alba
The Lordship of the Isles?

Hungary was not the most powerful state in Europe. Bulgaria, the HRE, England, France, Spain, and the Golden Horde were far more powerful in their respective eras than Hungary was at the same time.
 
Joined Feb 2011
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The Lordship of the Isles?

Hungary was not the most powerful state in Europe. Bulgaria, the HRE, England, France, Spain, and the Golden Horde were far more powerful in their respective eras than Hungary was at the same time.

Medieval France as real existing state had a short period of existence (under 1-2 heavy handed french king) In most of medieval "France" was not more reality than a legal term. HRE, after OTTO I became more and more anarchic therefore it hadn't real efficiency. (in most of its existence, the HRE wasn't reality but a legal term also) The others haven't enough population (little countries) to be real power in medieval age, or they were "wooden-built"/ mostly semi-nomadic orthodox countries with non-existing balkan economy. Remember that balkan countries (After hungarian king Bela III reduced the byzantine influence in balkan) became the playground of Hungarian kings and later the Ottoman Empire
 
Joined Feb 2011
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The Lordship of the Isles?

Hungary was not the most powerful state in Europe. Bulgaria, the HRE, England, France, Spain, and the Golden Horde were far more powerful in their respective eras than Hungary was at the same time.

What a mistake.....Spain didn't exist as state until the end of 15th century. Golden Horde together with mongols who ruled russia were defeated many times by Hungarian kings. Bulgaria similar to other "wooden-built" orthodox balkan countries like serbia vallachia moldavia bosnia became vassals of Hungarian kings
 
Joined Jul 2010
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Munich, Capital of the Kingdom of Bavaria
Hungarian raids (we collected taxes from their monarchs....) in the 10th century
Kalandozasok.jpg

It seems Augsburg 955 was the last one to the west. it must have been so successful that the hungarians didnt want to bully the weaklings in the west any more... :rolleyes: The Lechfeld is near Augsburg, is it not?

Either way the threat says "1000-1500". 999 is still before 1000.

Ah, the good old "worst military blunder of all times" voting... :D
 
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It seems Augsburg 955 was the last one to the west. it must have been so successful that the hungarians didnt want to bully the weaklings in the west any more... :rolleyes: The Lechfeld is near Augsburg, is it not?

Either way the threat says "1000-1500". 999 is still before 1000.

Ausburg haha, HRE had succes because of heavy rain (the hungarian bows were destoyed weakened by rain) The cautious Otto I prohibited the persecution of Hungarians after the battle. Prohibited to organize campaigns against Hungarian homeland also. Because otto knows that he didn't meet the main forces of the Hungarian grand-prince, he met only with western chieftains.

Otto remembered to [ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Pressburg]Battle of Pressburg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame] , and he didn't dare to attack Hungarians in their homeland.
Some HR. Emperor tried to attack /occupy hungary in the 11th century, but very few german/italian and frankish soldiers/knights survived their lost disastrous battles in Hungary
 
Joined Nov 2009
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Outer world
Venice could be a good example, surely it hasn't many MP, anyway, It could count on the most powerful fleet of Mediterranen(whether not of all europe) and probably the richest economy, and it was a city of 50-100.000 inhabitants.
 
Joined Jul 2010
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Munich, Capital of the Kingdom of Bavaria
Ausburg haha, HRE had succes because of heavy rain (the hungarian bows were destoyed weakened by rain) The cautious Otto I prohibited the persecution of Hungarians after the battle. Prohibited to organize campaigns against Hungarian homeland also. Because otto knows that he didn't meet the main forces of the Hungarian grand-prince, he met only with western chieftains.

Otto remembered to Battle of Pressburg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia , and he didn't dare to attack Hungarians in their homeland.
Some HR. Emperor tried to attack /occupy hungary in the 11th century, but very few german soldiers/knights survived their lost battles in Hungary

If that is what they tell you in happened in Hungary it must be that we're in germany again are told lies. :) By the way, why did you stop to come over when you would have won if it not had been for that meddling rain? ;)
 
Joined Feb 2011
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Venice could be a good example, surely it hasn't many MP, anyway, It could count on the most powerful fleet of Mediterranen(whether not of all europe) and probably the richest economy, and it was a city of 50-100.000 inhabitants.

Venice became vassal of the Hungarian King : Louis the great

Southern Italian and Napolitan campaigns of Louis the Great of Hungary
Read about this powerful monarch:

[ame=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_I_of_Hungary]Louis I of Hungary - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

Italian monarchs feared from Hungarian power. The most Italian princes knelt down before they speak to Louis.
 
Joined Feb 2011
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If that is what they tell you in happened in Hungary it must be that we're in germany again are told lies. :) By the way, why did you stop to come over when you would have won if it not had been for that meddling rain? ;)

Yes, we beat similar large HRE armies at least 19 times (of course without rain) But germans didn't meet the great prince's main army. Germans defeated 2 western Hungarian chieftains armies in 955. It's a big difference, that's why Otto was cautious to organize a frontal attack against Hungarian homeland.

But it can't change the fact, medieval HRE lost 7 wars from 9 against Hungary. It's a very very bad ratio for HRE.....
 
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