An ancient Somalian form of writing?

[Atlantids]

Another trick of the Afrocentrics is to claim they are "equal-seekers" e.g. let "White" Europeans have their history (Greece, Rome etc) but "Black" Africans have their own e.g. Egypt. By setting up this fallacy they try to project themselves as victims of "Eurocentrism" etc and "truth seekers" of no bias or "ism" ideology.

However you only have to scan the people themselves who employ this trick to realise it is total nonsense and they don't even believe it.

"Just Call me Jari" or "Jari" is a key example. He tries to portray himself as a moderate non-Afrocentric "equal-seeker" giving European history to the "White" Europeans, while Africa to the "Black" Africans. But wait....

"The idea that Septimius Severus was white is not based on fact, just a Euroclown wet dream" - Just Call me Jari
EgyptSearch Forums: Is the tunisian president part nubian?

He has a whole more string of posts arguing many Roman emperors were not "White" either but "Black", alongside the Minoans who he claims were predominantly "Black" and so forth.

These Afrocentrics have no interest in "equality". Although some of them try to pretend they accept European history is "white" behind the scenes, they claim most of European history is "Black".

So you can't believe a word these people say. They are motivated by a racialized agenda, they have no objectivity or interest in the truth.

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

Without knowing their place of origin, yes I would perhaps consider number 1 and 2 as black. You got me. Not 3 and 4 though.

BTW, I don't know much about genetics, but I mostly agree with what you have posted on this thread. Great to have another person interested in Ancient Egypt on this site. I just hope we would have more diverse discussions about this great civilization here on Historum. Too many times the threads are all about their race, which is pretty boring issue afterall.

Thanks mans.

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

A) You are not dictating the terms of this conversation
B) No genetics model (not even your own) agrees that there has been much mixing in historical time.

Wait but didn't you state the Ancient Egyptians were mixed?

You still clearly have not read through the genetics study I have posted and I do not intend to get into it in detail yet again when it has all been posted for you and discussed already.

Are you talking about the Henn study?

Overwhelmingly geneticists think that this mix happened in the stone ages. Read though the studies. And many show the Eurasian admixture as much higher by the by. But it is not particularly important.

I never read a study which mentions mixing happening in prehistoric times of Egypt. During those times Egypt was occupied by many different cultures from Aterian, khormusan and Halfan...Which were all African.

More word games. Modern Egyptians are very closely related to their ancestors. No genetics study disagrees with this. they disagree on how much is African and how much is Eurasian, but they do no disagree that they are the same people. Today, they do not largely consider themselves "black" and are not largely considered by others "black." If you understand this, then we have no disagreements. If you are going to push that they were once a different people, and in the next breath after that say that they were "black" even though you don't believe in the word, then you need to produce a GENETIC STUDY that shows it to be so. Lucotte agrees with me.

Aye....You're basically agreeing with me and you don't even know it. Again when they're talking modern Egyptians their talking about upper Egyptians. I already showed you Upper Egyptians Y-DNA being predominately African. And please stop throwing the word black into this African. WHEN I MADE IT CLEAR THAT NOT ALL AFRICANS CONSIDER THEMSELVES AFRICAN.

More limb lengths, which is garbage science. Where is your genetic study that counters everything I have posted? I have been playing this game for a very long time now and can keep playing it. No geneticist agrees with you or they guys taking tape measures to skeletons.

1. No its not....It tells us who the Ancient Egyptians were.
2. Geneticist doesn't always tell us everything.
3. You keep talking about geneticist agreeing that the Ancient Egyptians were mixed, but I never read study that even states what you're saying. I read through your post and non agrees that there were any Eurasian mixture pre-historic times in Egypt. I think I remember you or someone saying Lower Egypt was Eurasian for 30k years, yet U6 which is associated with those Eurasians entering Africa is not found in Egypt but the Maghreb....

I don't see that at all. The only genetic evidence that I have seen posted is the Lucotte chart, which shows less than 30% admixture even in lower Egypt, and if I remember correctly does not date it. Most members of upper Egypt are not "black" either, despite any culling of a few pictures. Egyptians are not largely considered black.

Did I say they were?

More word games. You are trying to prove they used to be a different people, but you won't say black because you don't like the word.

Aye...I think you have poor reading comprehensions or poor memory. I clearly said Upper Egyptians are closest to the Ancients because unlike Lower Egypt, Upper Egypt didn't absorb as many foreign admixture. Upper Egyptians are not the only ones closest to the Ancients, but modern day Nubians...

Quote:
''Individuals from northern Sudan clustered together with those from Egypt, and individuals from southern Sudan clustered with those from the Karamoja population (Uganda). The similarity of the Nubian and Egyptian populations suggest that migration, potentially bidirectional, occurred along the Nile river Valley, which is consistent with the historical evidence for long-term interactions between Egypt and Nubia.''
Source (Result; 5th sentence):
Investigative Genetics | Full text | Genetic variation and population structure among Sudanese populations as indicated by the 15 Identifiler STR loci

Stronger evidence points to the relation between Ancient Egypt & Nubia to of occurred before the establishment of those civilizations in the ''late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene'' periods. As opposed to Egyptians & Nubian civilizations conquering each other later.
__________

Quote:
''However, a synthesis of evidence from archaeology, historical linguistics, texts, distribution of haplotypes outside Egypt, and some demographic considerations lends greater support to the establishment, before the Middle Kingdom, of the observed distributions of the most prevalent haplotypes V, XI, and IV. It is suggested that the pattern of diversity for these variants in the Egyptian NILE VALLEY was largely the product of population events that occurred in the late Pleistocene to mid-Holocene through the First Dynasty, and was sustained by continuous smaller-scale bidirectional migrations/interactions. The higher frequency of V in Ethiopia than in Nubia or upper (southern) Egypt has to be taken into account in any discussion of variation in the NILE VALLEY.''
Source:
History in the interpretation of the p... [Am J Hum Biol. 2005 Sep-Oct] - PubMed - NCBI

Look...one last time.

There are two extant genetics models.

Overwhelmingly, geneticist agree that Egyptians were a mixed race from various migrations in the stone ages. Overwhelmingly.

A small number of genetic studies, which I respect but do not necessarily agree with, such as Lucotte and Tishkoff, say that they are primarily African even today. This of course means that there were never any great waves of invaders that altered them. They look more like middle easterners because they had already phenotypically developed to look as such.

They were never a different people.

If you agree with that, then we are fine. But please do not turn around and say: "oh, but they were a different people who I would not call black because I do not use the term, though others might call them black."

They are the same people that they always were.

Again you do nor read my words clearly...I clearly said a thousand times that the Upper Egyptians are STILL mostly the same due to not absorbing a lot of foreign admixture. I asked you were they talking about Upper Egypt or Lower Egypt? Which you still have not explained, I'm sure they are talking about Upper Egypt. You being denial about foreign settlement in Lower Egypt in dynastic times isn't going to help your case. In dynastic times the delta region(Lower Egypt) was not as populated as it was back then. Lower Egypt was where foreign settlements/immigration occurred.

And what various of migrations are you even talking? Prehistoric Egypt was occupied by many African cultures... Aterian, khormusan and Halfan. From 80k-15k. If anything studies have shown us Africans migrating out of Lower Egypt and entering the Levant.

Again I asked to post studies which indicate if there was even a mixture that happened that far back.

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

Heads up, most the users you are debating

Only a few weeks ago he posted this:

"I mean if the Moors were Black/African then that would be a big blow to white supremacy, bigger than the Ancient Egyptians being African. Sure the Ancient Egyptians had one of the most advanced civilizations. But the Moors dominated Europe for over 600 years! That right there is a big giant blow for white supremacy. White supremacy has placed an illusion that Blacks/African history is suppose to be about black people being slaves and nothing more. But the Moors completely shatters that, not only does it shatters it, it has blacks being the slavers themselves and the whites(Europeans) the slaves...The ones being dominated."
EgyptSearch Forums: What is more important to Eurocentrics?

These Afrocentrics are not tricking anyone by their claim they aren't arguing for a "Black" Egypt... They just make themselves look dumber and dumber each day.

LOL! How cute...Trying for a character assassinations instead of actually trying to address and counter my points. Again how cute...Instead of trying to go for a character assassination, try understanding where I was coming from.

Yes I meant what I said. White supremacy and Eurocentric like to believe only people black or people of African descent were slaves and not them. When in fact almost everyone on this earth was enslaved by one another. Yes I stand by what I meant. IF the Moors were black or African that would destroy the myth of Africans always being slaves and Europeans not be slaves. But that's another topic. Yes I did refer to the Moors as black, because I read a few historical records that referred to them as such and some people would consider the Moors black. I DO NOT refer to the Ancient Egyptians as black because they themselves didn't refer to themselves as black and neither did the people who documented them.

I do fully even agree that the Moors were African or black because I am not that versed on the Moors. You call me an Afrocentric? Fine...Okay its just a word. But I'm not tricking anyone. You trying to go for character assassinations is both childish and pathetic. And no that thread was not made a few weeks ago but actually two months ago... -__-

And again yes I was in fact serious about that thread. I was curious to know what Eurocentrics were more interested in because they both are truly invested in both topics.

Oh and if you want to play games here me debating against Clyde Winters and a bunch of Afronuts.
http://www.egyptsearch.com/forums/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=008161
^^^Do I look Afrocentric there? You see how easy that was?

 

[Atlantids]

Again I asked to post studies which indicate if there was even a mixture that happened that far back

Admixture/multidirectional gene flow into Africa has occurred throughout the Pleistocene.

"Finally, the form of the frontal bone and occipital in Dejbel Irhoud suggests considerable genetic exchange between human populations around the circum-Mediterranean prior to 100,000 years ago (Simmons and Smith 1991). The shared morphological features of Djebel Irhoud with specimens outside Africa suggest a web of interconnected lineages extending back into the Middle and early Upper Pleistocene" (Frayer et al., 1993)

Wolpoff and Lee (2012) have recently shown that Neanderthals were interbreeding with Herto, and identify more than one centres of AMH. In other words, there was no single origin for human "modernity" -- a serious blow to the Out of Africa theory.

 

[Atlantids]

Out of Africa, the final nail in the coffin...

Wolpoff and Lee (2012)

 

[Atlantids]

LOL! How cute...Trying for a character assassinations instead of actually trying to address and counter my points. Again how cute...Instead of trying to go for a character assassination, try understanding where I was coming from.

Yes I meant what I said. White supremacy and Eurocentric like to believe only people black or people of African descent were slaves and not them. When in fact almost everyone on this earth was enslaved by one another. Yes I stand by what I meant. IF the Moors were black or African that would destroy the myth of Africans always being slaves and Europeans not be slaves. But that's another topic. Yes I did refer to the Moors as black, because I read a few historical records that referred to them as such and some people would consider the Moors black. I DO NOT refer to the Ancient Egyptians as black because they themselves didn't refer to themselves as black and neither did the people who documented them.

I do fully even agree that the Moors were African or black because I am not that versed on the Moors. You call me an Afrocentric? Fine...Okay its just a word. But I'm not tricking anyone. You trying to go for character assassinations is both childish and pathetic. And no that thread was not made a few weeks ago but actually two months ago... -__-

And again yes I was in fact serious about that thread. I was curious to know what Eurocentrics were more interested in because they both are truly invested in both topics.

Oh and if you want to play games here me debating against Clyde Winters and a bunch of Afronuts.
EgyptSearch Forums: 1000-year-old African coins found in Australia
^^^Do I look Afrocentric there? You see how easy that was?

Ok great, however I have no further interest in wasting time with Afrocentrics -- the data I posted exposes who you are. I didn't join this forum with that intention. I joined here a week or so back to promote my research on Plato/Atlantis. It didn't surprise me that the Afroloons from Egyptsearch would be here. They are also on Anthroscape, Forumbiodiversity, and countless others. These people sadly will never disappear, just how UFO conspiracy theorists etc don't. The internet will always attrack the

-- Feel free to continue with that catchibatches guy.

 

[Jari]

As I said your evidence was addressed and dealt with in the past, evidence presented only for you to blatantly ignore evidence and then pretend in other threads as if you are victorious.

http://historum.com/history/49479-nubia-birthed-egypt-11.html
The fact is you can't even name any of these Genetic Markers that are supposedly Eurasian going back 80,000 yrs. You're so deluded that you don't even realize that even Modern Egyptians are genetically African mostly. This is why Archeology and Anthoropology, and Linguistics is so important in this debate, why Keita is so Important because Genetics can't solve anything...Why because evey Geneticists has their own personal opinions on whether e3b is African or Eastern Derived.

Like I said we know where the Egyptians came from. But please keep on deluding yourself, more and more mainstream studies are coming out every other month on the cultural origins of Egypt in the Green Sahara and the Nubian Desert. If you were willing to learn and debate/discuss without the chip on your shoulder Id be more than happy, as I already said and still say there were Eurasian types in the Delta from Early times and many achieved high positions. Yet you're not here to discuss simply to present yourself as some raider and savior of modern Egyptians against boogymen Afrocentrics.

Keep hope alive thinking some dynastic race brought anything significant to Egypt...
Here:

and please if you think Keita is my only evidence your more deluded than I thought. My Ramblings disproved you spam

Please carefully re-read the studies in post 21. I have ALL of the proof.

Despite Jari's ramblings,
Jari and crew's only source of "evidence," Keita, poor source that it is, actually agrees with me.

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

Ok great, however I have no further interest in wasting time with Afrocentrics -- the data I posted exposes who you are. I didn't join this forum with that intention. I joined here a week or so back to promote my research on Plato/Atlantis. It didn't surprise me that the Afroloons from Egyptsearch would be here. They are also on Anthroscape, Forumbiodiversity, and countless others. These people sadly will never disappear, just how UFO conspiracy theorists etc don't. The internet will always attrack the

-- Feel free to continue with that catchibatches guy.

Again how cute. Thinking you so called exposed me. Got any other post of mines you want to share? Please entertain me. And of course anyone is a 'Afroloon' if they disagree with you.

 

[Jari]

"The idea that Septimius Severus was white is not based on fact, just a Euroclown wet dream" - Just Call me Jari
EgyptSearch Forums: Is the tunisian president part nubian?

If you have evidence to prove me wrong about Septimius, then please feel free to disprove me. Ill whip that ... here just as I did on Egyptsearch...so please stop trolling and make an appropriate thread to disprove me hoss.

He has a whole more string of posts arguing many Roman emperors were not "White" either but "Black", alongside the Minoans who he claims were predominantly "Black" and so forth.

Please show a scrap of evidence where I claim the Minoans as being "Predominantly black". Did'nt you learn you lesson from posting people's personal info on ES? You're barking up the wrong tree, I fight fire with fire..

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

Lol...Now Atlantids AKA Faheemdunkers is now trying to desperately disprove the Out of Africa. This character is funny.

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

Please show a scrap of evidence where I claim the Minoans as being "Predominantly black". Did'nt you learn you lesson from posting people's personal info on ES? You're barking up the wrong tree, I fight fire with fire..

The character always does that instead of trying to stick to the original argument at hand. Just shows he has no argument.

 

[Jari]

Id post some of his stuff from E.S but Im sure such behavior is forbidden by the Moderators here...i.e posting stuff about members from other forums. TBH, Im not here to play with Trolls like him. Me and Cachi have our disagreement but Cachi is honestly interested in what he sees as African History in like Cassite.

The character always does that instead of trying to stick to the original argument at hand. Just shows he has no argument.

 

[Kilwa Sultanate]

Id post some of his stuff from E.S but Im sure such behavior is forbidden by the Moderators here...i.e posting stuff about members from other forums. TBH, Im not here to play with Trolls like him. Me and Cachi have our disagreement but Cachi is honestly interested in what he sees as African History in like Cassite.

Yeah I think its better just to ignore him. He's not worth it. I actually have no problems with Cachi.

 

[Atlantids]

"The idea that Septimius Severus was white is not based on fact, just a Euroclown wet dream" - Just Call me Jari

And this was Jari's "evidence" posted in 2011/12:

"Historia Augusta
p431 The Life of Pescennius Niger

Now when the confusion in the state was at its height, inasmuch as it was made known that there were three several emperors, Septimius Severus, Pescennius Niger, and Clodius Albinus, the priest of the Delphic Apollo was asked which of them as emperor would prove of most profit to the state, whereupon, it is said, he gave voice to a Greek verse as follows:

"Best is the Dark One, the African good, but the worst is the White One."

p449 2 And in this response it was clearly understood that Niger was meant by the Dark One, Severus by the African, and Albinus by the White One. 3 Thereupon the curiosity of the questioners was aroused, and they asked who would really win the empire. To this the priest replied with further verses somewhat as follows:

"Both of the Black and the White shall the life-blood be shed all untimely;

Empire over the world shall be held by the native of Carthage."

Yet there is no physical description of Severus here whatsoever. Further, although Niger is called "Black" and "Dark One", the same source explains why on p. 443:

"''In stature Niger was tall, in appearance attractive; and his hair grew back in a graceful way toward the crown of his head. His voice was so penetrating that when he spoke in the open he could be heard a thousand paces away, if the wind were not against him. His countenance was dignified and always somewhat ruddy; 6 his neck was so black that many men say that he was called Niger on this account. The rest of his body, however, was very white and he was inclined to be fat. He was fond of wine, sparing in his use of food, and as for intercourse with women, he abstained from it wholly save for the purpose of begetting children''

Pescennius Niger just had a dark neck, quote: ''The rest of his body, however, was very white''.

- This is typical of Afrocentrics. So low IQ, they can't even read classical texts.

 

[Atlantids]

Id post some of his stuff from E.S but Im sure such behavior is forbidden by the Moderators here...i.e posting stuff about members from other forums. TBH, Im not here to play with Trolls like him. Me and Cachi have our disagreement but Cachi is honestly interested in what he sees as African History in like Cassite.

So explain why 9 Afrocentrics from ES have been banned here? Claus was even banned today, or yesterday. All that is left is you, and "Son of Ra". And among that banning list was not just "extreme" Afrocentrics like Iron Lion but those who pretend to be "moderate".

You are banned everywhere, because Afrocentrism is universally regarded as trolling. Reversing that claim doesn't work. How many "Eurocentrics" have been banned here? None. That's because "Eurocentrism" (a neologism coined in context by Afrocentrics) is actually mainstream scholarship.

 

[okamido]

Closed for review

 

[okamido]

Forget it, there is no way this thread is reopening.


Now, to the new members, and older ones, that have brought feuds to Historum from another internet site......it stops now. Take heed of our guidelines and follow the rules. http://historum.com/announcements/announcements.html

From this point on, I will take note of the individuals that were involved here, and if it happens again you will receive suspensions without further warning. If you have problems with another member, or if someone gets out of hand in a thread, then report it to the Moderator team.

~ okamido